H&E Equipment Services Q3 2023 Earnings Call Transcript

Quartr
Provided by Quartr
October 26, 2023

There are 10 speakers on the call.

Operator

Good morning, and welcome to the H and E Equipment Services Third Quarter 2023 Earnings Conference Call. Today's call is being recorded. At this time, I would like to turn the conference over to Mr. Jeff Testaine, Vice President of Investor Relations. Please go ahead, sir.

Speaker 1

Good morning and welcome. Thank you for your participation and ongoing interest in H and E. Earlier today, we issued a press release Providing a review of our financial performance for the Q3 of 2023. The release can be found along with all supporting statements and schedules on the H and And can be found on our website under the Investor Relations tab in Events and Presentations. Joining me today, as you'll see on Slide 2, are Brad Barber, Chief Executive Officer John Enquist, President and Chief Operating Officer and Leslie Magee, Chief Financial Officer and Corporate Secretary.

Speaker 1

Brad will begin this morning's discussion. But before I turn the call over to him, I'll ask you to proceed to Slide 3 as I remind you that today's call contains forward looking statements within the meaning of the federal securities laws. Statements about our beliefs and expectations and statements containing words such as may, Could, believe, expect, anticipate and other expressions constitute forward looking statements. Forward looking statements involve known and unknown risks and uncertainties, which could cause actual results to differ materially from those contained in any forward looking statement. A summary of these uncertainties It is included in the Safe Harbor statement contained in the company's slide presentation for today's call and includes the risks Investors, potential investors and other listeners are urged to consider these factors carefully in evaluating the forward looking statements and are cautioned not to place undue reliance on such forward looking statements.

Speaker 1

The company does not undertake to publicly update including the most directly comparable GAAP measure and an associated reconciliation as supporting schedules to our press release and in the appendix to today's presentation materials. I will now turn the call over to Brad Barber, Chief

Speaker 2

Thank you, Jeff. Good morning and welcome to our Q3 20 Our financial performance in the 3rd quarter continued a series of impressive results with record levels achieved across numerous metrics. I'll begin this morning covering our progress on key financial measures, followed by a more detailed review of our rental performance. I'll follow with my current thoughts on the equipment rental industry and how sturdy industry fundamentals and the emergence of certain compelling dynamics bode well As a final point, I'll review our progress towards our growth initiatives and how our focused execution has positioned us to meet performance was supported by resilient industry fundamentals, including healthy physical fleet utilization and continued rental rate appreciation. The contribution from these factors was magnified by the steady growth of our operations as demonstrated by a significant increase in fleet size and branch expansion.

Speaker 2

Similar to previous quarters, most of these key financial metrics displayed strong year over year improvement. For example, total revenues and total equipment rental revenues improved 23.6% and 24.5% Compared to the year ago results, while adjusted EBITDA improved 36.2% over the same period of comparison, Our adjusted EBITDA margin in the quarter rose to 47.2%. Each of these four metrics mentioned established a new record level of performance in the quarter. Total revenues were supplemented by used equipment sales, which increased more than 2.5 times in the quarter compared to the Q3 of 2022. The increase was due to our resuming typical fleet management practices, which were disrupted in 2022 by equipment shortages, Leading to extremely tight equipment availability.

Speaker 2

With the challenges slowly unwinding in 2023, we have returned to our traditional approach to the fundamental management

Speaker 3

of our rental fleet, which

Speaker 2

includes the sale of our older assets. Of our rental fleet, which includes the sale of our older assets. It is worth noting that in the Q3, we sold units with an average age of 75 months or 480 basis points higher than the year ago period. Also strong execution of strategic growth objectives once percent compared to the year ago quarter to just over $2,700,000,000 A portion of this fleet growth was used to supply equipment to our new And 8 additional locations to acquisition, representing 20% growth. We expect to see further expansion of our new locations In the Q4, I'll have more to say about the success of our growth strategy in a moment, but first I'd like to review our rental performance in greater detail.

Speaker 2

On to Slide 7 please. Rental revenue in the 3rd quarter improved 25% compared to the year ago quarter. Rental gross margins were 53.3% compared to 55.6% over the same period of comparison. When compared to the Q2 of 2023, rental gross margins improved 150 basis points. As I have noted before, the decline in our year over year rental gross margin reflected in part the impact of purchase price accounting following the October 2020 2 acquisition of OneSource.

Speaker 2

Our robust non residential construction environment continued to support rental rate and fleet utilization in the 3rd quarter. Rental rates improved 4.9% compared to the Q3 of 2022, while increasing 1.2% on a sequential quarterly basis. Through September 30, 2023, rental rates were 7% better than the same period in 2022. We believe these pricing results remain among the best in the industry. Physical utilization in the 3rd quarter was 70% levels for the industry.

Speaker 2

Finally, dollar utilization in the 3rd quarter of 41.5% compared to 42.7% In the prior year quarter, with the contribution from higher rental rates offset by lower utilization and a modest burden from our 2023 growth initiatives. However, the measure improved 90 basis points in a sequential basis. I now want to move my discussion to an industry outlook and elaborate on some emerging developments that we believe will sustain industry demand and facilitate a strong business environment in 2024. Slide 8 please. Non residential construction remains resilient with emerging project opportunities leading to expansion of backlogs and project Visibility well into 2024.

Speaker 2

Recent data from the U. S. Census Bureau continues to demonstrate healthy year over year construction starts and spending trends. Mega projects, which we define as possessing construction values of $500,000,000 and greater are expected to provide meaningful support for U. S.

Speaker 2

Construction activity. These projects, which include a variety of industrial and manufacturing construction opportunities continue to populate our geographic footprint and are characterized by substantial equipment requirements and lengthy project completion schedules. A review of data on mega projects Provided by Dodge Construction Network and PEC indicated projects with collective constructive values of Approximately $287,000,000,000 have started in 2023 with more than 75% of that project value within our coverage area. More importantly and as it relates to future project visibility, the data revealed an estimated $580,000,000,000 of project value was being bid project starts in 2023 2024 with an estimated 85% of these projects residing in our coverage area. Although this data is subject to change, it clearly implies the massive project opportunity that exists within our area of operations.

Speaker 2

Additionally, the value proposition of rental compared with equipment ownership is expected to lead to further growth in rental penetration. The measure has increased each of the last two years following the post COVID setback in 2020 is likely to experience further growth in 2023. These positive factors are expected to reinforce industry fundamentals and should allow for continuation of modest rental rate improvement And solid physical utilization levels as we maintain our focus on branch expansion and fleet growth into 2024. Finally, and before I turn the call over to Leslie for her review of the Q3 results, I want to close with an update on our fleet growth and branch expansion objectives. Slide 9, please.

Speaker 2

During the Q3, we had a greater branch density in the Mid Atlantic, Southeast, Gulf Coast and Midwest regions following the addition of 5 new locations in the quarter and a 6th in October. With 12 branch additions Through October 2023, we are within our stated range of 12 to 15 new locations for the year and we anticipate more openings during 4th quarter. H and E is now operating 132 branches in 30 states, including the addition of no fewer than 10 branches in each of the last 3 years. Also, our gross fleet expenditure in the 3rd quarter contributed to a record investment through 1st 9 months of 2023 of $595,200,000 resulting in a fleet size as measured by original equipment cost in excess of $2,700,000,000 In view of our gross expenditures at the close of the Q3, we're adjusting compared to a previously revised range of $600,000,000 to $650,000,000 In closing, our strong financial performance and numerous

Speaker 3

Our first question comes from the line of John Franzrebrenco. Thank you, Steve. Thank you, Steve.

Speaker 2

Thank you, Steve. Thank you, Steve.

Speaker 3

Thank you, Steve. Thank you, Steve. Thank you, Steve. Thank you, Steve.

Speaker 2

Thank you, Steve. Thank you, Steve. Thank you, Steve. Thank you, Steve. Thank you, Steve.

Speaker 2

Also, the branch growth is supported by our disciplined approach to fleet management, including a record investment 2023 of more than $595,000,000 to date. Our fleet age of 41.1 months remains among the youngest in the industry. We met or exceeded our stated 2023 strategic objectives with a quarter to spare, which is further evidence of our operational Capabilities and exceptional execution. As we turn our attention to 2024, we will again focus on strategic initiatives That continues to demonstrate our commitment to disciplined growth and expansion that leads to further achievements in value creation. With this, I'd ask you to proceed to Slide 10 and I'm going to turn the call over to Leslie, who will provide a review of our Q3 financial performance.

Speaker 2

Leslie?

Speaker 4

Thank you, Brad. Good morning, and welcome, everyone. Before I begin, I want to remind you, as stated in our press 3rd quarter results included a pretax noncash goodwill impairment charge of $5,700,000 which was identified in connection with an interim As reported and some as adjusted for the impact of the impairment charge. Let's continue beginning with Slide 11 and a review of 3rd quarter revenues, Total revenues in the 3rd quarter reached 400 $700,000 an improvement of $76,400,000 or 23.6 percent compared to the Q3 of 2022. The increase was primarily due to higher revenues in our rental and used equipment sales business segment.

Speaker 4

Rental revenues increased 25% to $280,300,000 compared to $224,100,000 in the year ago quarter. As Brad noted Earlier, strong fleet growth and further rental rate appreciation in the quarter were significant catalysts leading to the strong results. Our rental fleet, as measured by OEC, grew $589,900,000 or 27.6 on a year over year comparison and 1.2 percent sequentially. Used equipment sales in the Q3 were $52,700,000 compared to $20,300,000 in the Q3 of 2022. As equipment supply constraints in the year ago quarter continued to moderate in 2023, We captured attractive opportunities in the used equipment market by executing our fleet management objectives.

Speaker 4

New equipment sales of $12,600,000 declined 46.2% in the quarter compared to $23,500,000 in the Q3 of 2022. This decline reflects the impact of our December 2022 divestiture of the Komatsu Earthmoving distribution business, which completed our exit from distribution activities. Gross profit in the 3rd quarter grew to $188,400,000 up $36,500,000 compared to the year ago quarter. The 24% improvement resulted in gross profit margin in the quarter of 47% compared to 46.8 percent over the same period of comparison. The margin increase was due primarily to favorable revenue mix And higher margins on used equipment sales, partially offset by lower rental margins, which were impeded by purchase accounting related to the OneSource in the 3rd quarter compared to 50.5% in the year ago quarter, while rental margins finished the 3rd quarter at 53.3% compared to 50 5.6%.

Speaker 4

The purchase accounting impact on our margins relates to the higher depreciation expense resulting from the fair value markup of the fleet acquired Comparing margins for our business segments to the year ago quarter, used equipment margins increased to 58.5% compared to 3.7 percent. New equipment sales margins were 13.2% compared to 13.8%. Parts sales margins were 27.5% compared to 29% and lastly, service margins were 59.3% compared to 3.2%. Slide 12, please. Income from operations in the 3rd quarter totaled $79,200,000 or $84,900,000 excluding the previously noted pre tax non cash impairment charge of $5,700,000 The result compared to $64,000,000 in the Q3 of 2022.

Speaker 4

The margin on operating income was 19 1 8% or 21.2 percent excluding the impact of the goodwill impairment charge and compared to 19.7% in the year ago quarter. A favorable revenue mix, higher gross margins on used equipment sales and lower SG and A as a percent of revenues contributed to the improved margin. These factors were partially offset by lower rental margins resulting from the OneSource acquisition. Proceed to Slide 13, please. Net income from continuing operations in the 3rd Order totaled $48,900,000 or $53,000,000 adjusted for the goodwill impairment.

Speaker 4

The adjusted measure was 38.1 better than $38,400,000 in the year ago quarter. Diluted net income per share in the 3rd quarter was and compared to diluted net income per share of $1.05 in the Q3 of 2022. Our effective income tax rate in the 3rd quarter was 26.1 percent or 26.2 percent when adjusted for the goodwill impairment charge and compared to 25.2% for the same quarter in 2022. Proceed to Slide 14. Adjusted EBITDA in the 3rd quarter improved to a record $189,100,000 and compared to $138,900,000 in the year ago Order representing an improvement of 36.2% compared to a year over year increase in revenues of 23.6%.

Speaker 4

Adjusted EBITDA margin reached 47.2% in the 3rd quarter or 4 40 basis points better than the Q3 of 2022. The higher margin was primarily due to improved revenue mix, higher gross margins on used equipment sales and lower SG and A as a percentage of revenues. Next Slide 15, please. SG and A expense in the 3rd quarter increased 15,800,000 17.9 percent to $104,200,000 compared to SG and A of $88,400,000 in the year ago quarter. The increase was due to employees' salaries, wages and variable compensation as well as increased headcount.

Speaker 4

Also higher depreciation expense facility expenses and professional fees contributed to the increase in the quarter. Expressed as a percentage of revenues, SG and A expenses in the 3rd quarter were 26%, down from 27.3% in the prior year quarter. The increase in SG and A expenses in the quarter included an estimated $7,700,000 of expenses Attributable to 21 branches opened or acquired since the close of the prior year quarter. Slide 16, please. Gross rental fleet capital expenditures in the 3rd quarter inclusive of non cash transfers from Aury totaled $220,100,000 Net rental fleet capital expenditures were 167,700,000 Gross PP and E capital expenditures in the quarter were $22,000,000 or $21,000,000 net of sales of PP and E.

Speaker 4

Net cash provided by operating activities totaled $141,600,000 in the 3rd quarter compared to 107 compared to free cash flow used of $47,100,000 over the same period of comparison. At the conclusion of the 3rd Our rental fleet remained among the youngest in the industry with an average age of 41.1 months. The measure improved from an average age of 42 point 5 months in the Q2 of 2023 43.6 months at December 31, 2022. Slide 17, please. Based on original equipment cost on September 30, 2020 Our rental fleet size was modestly above $2,700,000,000 representing year over year growth of $589,900,000 or an increase of 27.6 percent.

Speaker 4

Average dollar utilization in the Q3 of 2023 was 41.5% compared to 42.7% in the prior year quarter and 40.6 Brad explained earlier how dollar utilization has been moderately impeded by our exceptional fleet growth and branch Slide 18, please. Our balance sheet metrics on September 30, 2023 remained strong, including net debt of Approximately $1,400,000,000 and a net leverage measure of 2.1 times. The metrics compare to net debt of 1,200,000,000 And net leverage of 2.2 times on December 31, 2022. We have no maturities before 2028 on our $1,250,000,000 of Senior unsecured notes. Slide 19, please.

Speaker 4

Our liquidity position on September 30, was approximately $1,800,000,000 up from $1,500,000,000 on December 31, 2022. Our minimum availability as defined by the ABL agreement remains $75,000,000 Note that excess availability is the measurement used to determine whether our With excess availability of $1,800,000,000 we continue to have no covenant concerns. And finally, we paid our regular quarterly dividend of $0.275 per share of common stock in the Q3 of 2023. While dividends are subject to Board approval, it is our intent to continue to pay the dividend. Slide 20, please.

Speaker 4

In closing, our impressive quarterly financial achievements continued in the Q3. Of note, total rental equipment revenues were up 24.5%, representing the 9th consecutive quarter of 20% or greater revenue growth in our rental operations when compared to the year ago results. Also, new records were once again established in the quarter across several important financial measures, including gross profit, adjusted EBITDA And adjusted net income. These financial achievements have largely followed our transition to a pure rental focus and a corresponding exit Quarter of 2021, we have grown our branch network nearly 25% to 132 branches currently compared to 106 at close of the Q2 in 2021, while broadening our U. S.

Speaker 4

Coverage to 30 states, up from 23 over the same period. In addition, our fleet size, as measured by OEC, has grown nearly 50% over the same period. Our strategic decisions and growth objectives have positioned H and E as one of the most successful companies in the equipment rental industry. With the outlook for our industry remaining bright, we will maintain our focus on profitable growth and expansion opportunities. We possess ample resources to pursue additional growth through strong net cash provided by operating activities and robust liquidity, While our net debt leverage remains at the low end of our stated range of 2 to 3 times.

Speaker 4

Our strong financial We are now ready to begin the Q and A period. Operator, would you please provide instructions to our call participants?

Operator

Yes, thank you. At this time, we will begin the question and answer session. At this time, we will pause momentarily to assemble the roster. And today's first question comes from Steven Razzi with Thompson Research Group.

Speaker 5

Hey, good morning. This is actually Brian Biros on for Steven. Thank you for taking my questions. First one on CapEx, You're raising CapEx even on lower time utilization and dollar utilization as you enter this lower season. Now check have told us that there's been better fleet delivery from OEMs.

Speaker 5

Can you just talk again to the logic behind this move and how much of it is The timing of increased deliveries, how much is intentional stocking up into 2024 and did you defer in deliveries?

Speaker 2

Sure. Good morning. Thank you for the question. The reason is simple, the assets that we plan to bring in Q4 That comprise the raise in our CapEx guys are very highly utilized many of these assets, 75% to 80% plus utilized. So That's the reason.

Speaker 2

It's not all products we're bringing in. This year, unlike last year, is starting To be more of a normal cadence, last year we ran an unsustainable and very unusual at very unusually high physical utilizations. So I think it's worth noting and remembering since we started rate improvements in 2021, I believe we're up something north of 18%. 70% utilization is a healthy level, certainly something we would like to further eclipse, but the capital we're bringing in, in the 4th quarter It's going to be basically replacement capital and it's only going to be capital deployed for extremely high physical physically utilized assets And we continue to get rate improvement on.

Speaker 5

Helpful. Thanks. And a follow-up, I guess, just on the overall market. You talked about Broad based strength. Some commercial is slowing that we're hearing to ABI is down, higher rates are likely to pressure some non res construction activity here.

Speaker 5

If some normal types of non res construction slows, do you think that's enough to suppress volumes or rates or utilization? Clearly, it's a matter of degree of movement, but how are you seeing the puts and takes at this point?

Speaker 2

I think there are several things to consider. First, the discipline of the industry. We have been and we will I believe we'll continue to work in a very Discipline industry as far as our competitors go. We spoke about and tried to get some real transparency to what we see with mega projects. Yes, I think we're talking between $23,000,000 $24,000,000 something in the neighborhood of $850,000,000,000 We said that of the projects that have bid so far, 75% of those are within our trade territory.

Speaker 2

And when we define a trade territory, we're talking about locations that Approximately 85% of that is within our trade territory. I'll take it a step further and say that we continue to see no postponements or cancellations of our more traditional project work that exists within our territory. So a lot of times you need to go people should really Roll through the data in a little bit more detail. If you were going to only be operating in 30 states, I think we can make an argument our 30 are as good as they come. So It's where the majority of this mega project money stimulus money is being spent.

Speaker 2

We happen to be there. We're adding density and we feel very good about what's in front of us Going into 2024.

Speaker 5

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. And the next question comes from Seth Weber with Wells Fargo Securities.

Speaker 6

Hi, guys. Good morning. Brad, I guess H and E and some of the peers have been selling more old For the last couple of quarters, I kind of just wanted to get your view on just sort of supply demand balance going forward. Do you feel like that we're in a position here where we could start talking about fleet utilization to be up next year Or maybe flat, but or could dollar utilization be up? Just not looking for specific guidance numbers, but just directionally how you're thinking about kind of Supply demand across the industry.

Speaker 6

Thanks.

Speaker 2

Yes. Good morning, Seth. I do believe things are coming back into more of a normal balance and Operating at more of a normal cadence. We're in the middle of our forecasting for 2024. Let me tell you, a couple of things.

Speaker 2

Number 1, we are focused on and feel very bullish about our opportunity to continue to stamp out 15 ish locations a year. So we're going to stick with our guidance of 10 to 15 locations and fully planned open 15 ish locations again And 2024, highly successful with that strategy. We're going to continue to have some level of same store growth. That being said and maybe more specific to your question, we believe we know we have operational capabilities Running much higher physical utilization than we're currently running at today, and we plan to flex those capabilities next year. And so as we that will be part of our consideration as we look at the growth.

Speaker 2

So plan on 15 ish, 10 to 15 locations next year. We'll be better and more clearly communicate once we're done with the plan, but we're going to have same store growth. And we believe that and I will tell you our internal focus is to improve our physical utilization in 2024 over what we're going to achieve in 2023. So I hope that's helpful to you.

Speaker 6

Yes, super helpful. Thank you. And then just on these mega projects, maybe if you could Help frame it, is H and E typically the lead would H and E typically be a lead Provider on these projects, would you be a partner with some of the other rental companies, maybe just sort of frame up how some of these contracts get let And how you're just the competitive environment within your footprint? Thanks.

Speaker 2

Sure. We're both. We're on a large majority of the projects that have been let within our and that are active within our footprint. I think that's the most important thing to note. There are more than just a few that we're the lead on.

Speaker 2

We have the majority and we'll have the majority of the products. But there are also Many more that we have a secondary or tertiary position on, but that still could mean hundreds of machines. And so we participate in all elements. Obviously, we have considerations to make. We're going to remain disciplined.

Speaker 2

We're focused on rate, certainly focused on returns. And these large projects that consume in some cases thousands of machines depending on the particular project and certainly for a much longer than average Duration requires some level of discounting and we look more yield, but you can see with our 1.2% sequential gain that We continue to push forward that we're continuing to get rates within the mix of what's going on at H and E. We will lead on more mega projects going forward We will be in the number 2 and number 3 position on others. And if there's a dynamic that does not favor our overall objectives for utilization And yield, then we certainly won't participate on some projects, but we're very selective and we're in good position with the projects that are within our footprint.

Speaker 6

Super helpful. Thank you. Thanks, Brad.

Speaker 2

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. And the next question comes from Stanley Elliott with Stifel.

Speaker 7

Good morning, everybody. Thank you for taking the question. Hey, Brad, first off, just for Point of clarification, in addition to the commentary about utilization, I thought I heard you say modest rate improvement as well. Was that for the Q4 or were you talking more specifically about 2024?

Speaker 2

Well, I think 24 is hard to say. I can tell you there's no thought of us abandoning in our focus on rate improvement. John, do you want to add some color for

Speaker 8

what I'm looking for? I would. Stanley, as Brad stated on these large mega jobs, Pricing is more aggressive. These projects are materializing as we speak. I mean, we have fleet on these jobs.

Speaker 8

We have more fleet that will be deployed in the Q4. And then next year, we have a considerable amount of these projects that are going to break ground. So As we put more fleet on these jobs, obviously at lower more aggressive pricing, there is going to be an impact to our overall rates. What that looks like, it's difficult to say at this point. What I can tell you is for Q4, we do expect incremental rate improvement.

Speaker 8

And looking to next year, we do expect demand to remain healthy. So our opportunity for rate improvement is going to be there. I think the question For us and what we need to do some more digging on is how are these large jobs going to impact rates as these projects continue to ramp up.

Speaker 2

Stanley, let me add and I fully support everything John just said that's spot on for our collective view. We're moving into more of a normal trajectory with utilization. Hypothetically, in Q1, if we were to suffer An extreme winter situation, smaller projects are delayed or postponed due to weather. And we believe these large mega projects We'll continue to go at a more steady pace. We could see a situation where we see rates flatten out.

Speaker 2

I want to be clear, that is not our prediction. That's not our goal internally. That's not what we're managing to. We would simply be talking about a mix issue. But for now, we're planning on incremental rental rate

Speaker 7

And Hina, with the concerns around ABI numbers and everything else, What are you guys watching to say maybe we should pivot or pause from some of the growth plans that we've You've got on the table, I mean, so far the growth plans have turned out quite nicely, but just curious kind of how you're thinking about that as kind of like the Longer term view?

Speaker 2

Sure. Well, yes, as Leslie stated in her prepared comments, we just concluded our 9th quarter of Greater than 20% growth. We did one tuck in acquisition that's having an anniversary this month OneSource last year, we're certainly not abandoning future tuck in acquisition opportunity. We never Overreact to the ABI, and I don't want to say we don't pay attention. We certainly do, but we look more at Dodge Construction, put in place dollars.

Speaker 2

We certainly consider the feedback And what we see going on. So I gave Seth some feedback basically saying We are very focused on improving our fiscal utilization incrementally next year over what we will achieve in 2023. I want to tell you, I'm nothing but very proud of our team's accomplishment in 2023 to stamp out this number of locations on our Small nucleus to start from while we raise rates and expand our margins. I believe it's quite impressive and shows what they're capable of. So we're not going to abandon that healthy growth levels.

Speaker 2

But bear in mind, if we open 12 to 15 locations next year, These are premium marketplace. We're not going to the only place we can find a facility. We're going where the market is most robust and And so at our current scale, this is absolutely to our advantage while we're in this 12 to 15 locations a year. But if you were to see us slow our fleet growth a little bit next year on a same store basis to ensure that we achieve Physical utilization improvement, I wouldn't be surprised.

Speaker 7

And that's kind of brings me to my last question. You've ramped Capital spend here pretty meaningfully the past several years. Some of your peers are generating free cash through the cycle. I feel like you guys have enough scale now with all the growth in the locations that you have in the marketplace. Maybe share some thoughts with investors on kind of at what point do you think you guys can start generating free cash flow through the cycle You absent kind of these larger fleet purchases that you've been bringing in?

Speaker 2

Yes, very good question. Obviously, we could generate some free cash right now today if we so elected. We have decided it's best for the valuation of the company, Within our operational capabilities, clearly, it is not stressing our balance sheet in the least as our leverage has continued to go down year over year while we're growing and continue So for the foreseeable future, as we grow, we could continue to be slightly free cash flow negative. But If we want to change that dynamic, it's easy. We just grow at a little bit slower pace and we generate cash.

Speaker 2

Maybe to the broader context of your question, I think we're within 2 to 3 years at the type of growth that we have been at, where we will be at a balance, where we will more consistently and Naturally, it can produce free cash flow. So it's something we look at. It's something we've talked about internally. I don't want to set an expectation Free cash flow on an annual basis going forward, but I will say this, we could clearly achieve that if that was a primary objective. But For today, we're going to grow while we lower our leverage and move into these hot markets that are going to pay dividends for decades to come.

Speaker 7

Perfect. Thanks so much and best of luck.

Operator

Thank you. And the next question comes from Steven Fisher with UBS.

Speaker 9

Thanks. Good morning. Just want to try and calibrate the profit from used equipment sales going forward. As we think about maybe that normalizing, Is there any kind of like historical periods you'd look back to, kind of going back to maybe pre pandemic levels, but then you have to adjust for your Your fleet size and the normalized margin, just how do we think about that kind of normalizing of used equipment profit generation?

Speaker 8

Stephen, I think as we've said before, we've had this question before and our expectation is to maintain that 50 plus percent gross margin on used sales. As far as any historical period to compare to, that's a little bit more Challenging considering that we were heavy in the distribution business years ago with the exit from distribution And really more predictable fleet sales as we move forward, we're going to focus on selling off the back end of our fleet. As Leslie and Brad discussed in their prepared comments, the age of the fleet assets that we sold in the Q3 was 72 months 75 months, excuse me. When you go back and compare that to prior periods, you would there's really nothing great to compare that So I think as we look forward, 50% plus is going to be our bogey and that's what our expectation is going to be moving forward.

Speaker 2

Yes. Look, if we see Softening in the youth equipment markets, with our balance sheet, with the age of our fleet, We can just slow our fleet sales. We do not have we are not going to give inventory away. And as John outlined, we're just a different business today being a pure rental model As opposed to also chasing market share for that downstream parts and service business, which was part of the distribution. So we're going to go with 50% right now.

Speaker 2

And if we see a need to change that, then we certainly will make sure we advise everyone.

Speaker 9

Got it. And then on the just a follow-up on the competitive environment question, to what extent do you see OEM dealer rental fleets ramping up and what impact are they having on the market?

Speaker 2

I'm not seeing or hearing anything Measurable about any OEM dealer rental fleet. The dealer rental fleets are no more significant today than they Have been in any prior period. So I don't see any change there whatsoever actually.

Speaker 9

Okay. And then just last, related to the mega projects, how should we think about the mix of fleet that they Do you see them as being balanced between aerials and earthmoving? Or is there any particular weighting shift that you see in your fleet purchasing?

Speaker 2

Yes. Nothing is going to change our purchasing. Actually, we don't disclose this, but as we look at it internally, the mix of products when you collect, When you aggregate a variety of mega projects, it's very similar to what we offer in the traditional construction process for smaller jobs. So We see no shift there whatsoever. We like our mix.

Speaker 2

It serves us well. We'll continue to work on it and refine it through our fleet management practices, But the mega projects will not change how we're investing in product types.

Speaker 9

Got it. Thank you very much.

Speaker 2

Thank you, Steve.

Operator

Thank you. And the next question comes from Alex Rygiel with B. Riley.

Speaker 8

Thank you very much. Nice quarter, gentlemen. Is there any specific End market or as it relates to mega projects that is more advantageous to you all?

Speaker 2

Not particularly. I mean, obviously, when we look through our footprint, there are some areas that inherently have Incremental more opportunity with the number of these mega projects that we're defining as $500,000,000 or greater. But maybe stated better, There aren't any areas that are broadly excluded from those types of opportunities. We're seeing it broad based.

Operator

And then can you talk

Speaker 8

a little bit about capital allocation towards purchasing new rental equipment versus Maybe a buyback or dividend?

Speaker 2

Well, we have shown and let me reaffirm, we're committed to the dividend. As we State in our remarks, it requires Board approval on a quarterly basis, but we're dedicated to that dividend. With our leverage and available and our liquidity position with our ABLs, Leslie pointed out, we challenge ourselves just on improving As it pertains to the potential stock buy We consider everything on behalf of capital allocation periodically and work with our Board closely on that. But for now, I can report to you that Everyone should expect more of the same. We're going to pay our dividend.

Speaker 2

We're going to invest where we can continue to improve returns on rental assets and grow These 12 to 15 locations a year while we have same store growth and we will always take into consideration other aspects that could become available to us.

Speaker 8

Very helpful. Thank you.

Speaker 2

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. And the next question is a follow-up from Seth Weber with Wells Fargo Securities.

Speaker 6

Hi. Thanks for taking the follow-up. I just wanted to go back to the mega project pricing competition discussion. In a more challenging rate environment, can you just talk to like would margins be affected by that or do you or Margin or does it kind of wash out on the margin line because there's less because you have more surety of demand, the equipment Sitting on-site, there's less pickup, drop off, that kind of thing. I'm just trying to think through how I understand the rate Is there a potential margin impact as well or does that kind of get washed out?

Speaker 2

No, it gets washed out. We are not planning The amount of product, the mix of product, the discount that's required in the letter term. So No, we do not anticipate degradation to our margins due to participation on larger projects. That yield is going to be positive.

Speaker 6

Okay. That's helpful. Thanks, guys.

Speaker 2

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. And this concludes the question and answer session. Would like to turn the call to Jeff Chastain for any closing comments.

Speaker 7

Okay. Well, if there are

Speaker 8

no other questions, we'll go ahead

Speaker 1

and conclude today's call. We do appreciate Everyone taking the time to join us today and for your continued interest in H and E. We look forward to speaking with you again. Good day everyone.

Operator

Thank you. The conference has now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect.

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Earnings Conference Call
H&E Equipment Services Q3 2023
00:00 / 00:00
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