EPAM Systems Q1 2023 Earnings Call Transcript

Quartr
Provided by Quartr
May 5, 2023

There are 12 speakers on the call.

Operator

Good day, and thank you for standing by. Welcome to the EPAM Systems First Quarter 2023 Earnings Conference Call. At this time, all participants are in a listen only mode. After the speakers' presentation, there will be a question and answer Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded. I would now like to hand the conference over to your speaker today, David Straube, Head of Investor Relations.

Operator

Please go ahead.

Speaker 1

Thank you, operator, and good morning, everyone. By now, you should have received your copy of the earnings release for the company's Q1 2023 results. If you have not, a copy is available on epam.com in the Investors section. With me on today's call are Arkadiy Dobkin, CEO and President and Jason Peterson, Chief Financial Officer. I'd like to remind those listening that some of the comments made on today's call may contain forward looking statements.

Speaker 1

These statements are subject to risks and uncertainties as described in the company's earnings release and SEC filings. Additionally, all references to reported results that are non GAAP measures have been reconciled to the comparable GAAP measure and are available in our quarterly earnings materials located in the Investors section of our website. With that said, I'll now turn the call over to Ark.

Speaker 2

Thank you, David. Thank you for joining us today. 3 months ago, we shared some details of what we are thinking about 2023 and how we saw the main factors and trends driving our performance during the year. As you will recall, We anticipated some level of market slowdown in general demand, but we are not certain of the impact level of the slowdown in our own portfolio yet. We also saw that some of our customers were mitigating the risk exposure due to the war in Ukraine With the understanding of all of that, we were proactively investing in building scalable quality delivery locations outside of our traditional comfort zone to consistently delivering comparable engineering quality across all of our growing global delivery markets.

Speaker 2

And we also stated that we were expecting to continuously optimize operations across our global delivery locations to bring the cost structure back to our traditional metrics in near and medium timeframe. And despite a number of the EPAM specific challenges, We believe that the market for our services continues to be strong and our proposition remains extremely relevant. So we were broadly expecting a general uplift in demand going into the second half of twenty twenty three. Today, 3 months later, we understand that with the visibility we had in fewer quarters, we underestimated The breadth of the macroeconomic slowdown and the depth of the impact specifically in the transformational sector of the IT services market. And as you know, we always stated that our customers are almost exclusively Global 2,000 Enterprises, Leading Global Platform Companies and Venture backed Emerging Tech Firms who are allowing NEPAM to design, engineer and deploy exactly life scale transformational and digital engineering programs, helping them to grow and to differentiate themselves based on technology advanced solutions.

Speaker 2

Our work largely support The disruptive business model accelerates growth and specifically targets new product data and cloud platform development and modernization programs. Such work was an ease in our focus area and represents a very significant share of our revenue, especially in comparison with most of other companies within the Global IT Services segment. Exactly that type of work was largely responsible for our significantly stronger growth rates during the last few decades. Unfortunately, it is exactly those programs All currently show invisible signs of weakness. Instead, during the last 3 months, it become very clear The economic environment is more focused than it has been for decades on cost optimization, which for now benefiting more traditional outsourcing firms with strong cost takeout offerings.

Speaker 2

We understand this is likely a continuous story as the markets adjust to the new economic conditions and the investment climate changes. It means That is all global and visual impact on demand and the headwinds associated with the war. We must accept The picture for EPAM is more complex and nuanced and yes, visibly changed today from what we shared with you just 3 months ago. But before we go into what we're doing to address the immediate challenges and to share some of our more tactical priorities and efforts, I want to restate our view on our mid and long term positioning in the future beyond 2023 growth perspective. Let me start with something we all know well.

Speaker 2

Technology change and the disruption of traditional business models was the main growth driver during the last decade. During those decades, we saw only 3 relatively short recessional periods for the technology sector. There is simple evidence that those companies who invested in their digital transformation during the slow periods and those who adapted to new Tech and Applied new business models realized by the TechFaster versus those who just focused on straight cost cutting become the new leaders in their markets. For us, each of those short downturns led to resurgence in demand for our unique and consequently to our historical growth rates of 20 plus percent and on very consistent and long term basis. We believe that nothing changed from that trend and we are in the middle of another turn when we about to adopt a new wave of technology impact.

Speaker 2

This is why we believe that the current situation is temporary And that in line with the past, we will see a similar comeback pattern, pushing companies we strive to lead for accelerated investments a new and disruptive complex solution based on rapid adoption of new advanced technologies. With that, we also believe that we will continue to benefit from our traditional capabilities and our delivery track record and that give us We confident that we are fundamentally better positioned for future accelerated growth than most of other market players. Those critical important pillars include: 1st, our continuous focus on differentiated product and platform development versus more traditional outsourcing BPO and packet implementation bills and our engineering DNA built over decades. Those make us the best partner to learn, understand and implement new solutions, which aligns in the next generation technologies. And yes, we do want to share it with you in anticipation of the large equation that is a public adoption of generativeai and widespread use of large language models or LLMs, we already have dozens active Use cases across the global network of practitioners in all our verticals and horizontal functional areas that we are actively proceeding with both internally and with our customers.

Speaker 2

2nd, our investments And broad deployment of EPAM Continuum Integrated Consulting Services, push strategy and experience even closer with the brand new And together accelerating the value we can bring from investments in data and machine learning and Gen AI Technologies by advising on what is possible tomorrow and what can be made real today. And third, All of our customer engagements and our people are enabled by our own digital platforms, which preparing us much Stronger for applying enhanced capabilities of ML and AI and LLMs to drive increased work productivity and knowledge sharing at a new global scale for us. To sum up, in our view, even with complicated macroeconomic headwinds, The market still points towards disruption and demands companies to transform again to address the challenges posed by many emerging technologies, including such as generative AI, which everyone is talking about it today. But what is difficult to predict right now is when this comeback will start at full speed. We believe that it will be happening rather sooner than later, in quarters, not in years.

Speaker 2

Still right now, we obviously have An immediate and different challenge. So let us talk about our last quarter and our thinking about the rest of 2023. With all the complexities of current environment, our performance in the Q1 was solid. While that gives us a better start to move further into Conference 2023 environment, we have to acknowledge that the combination of conditions we talked already today of general pullback and delays on transformation spend and the new risk concerns taken by our customers has now translated into a revision to our initial revenue expectation for a year. With this new view, we are adjusting visibly our full year revenues and EPS outlook.

Speaker 2

And during the year, expect to be thinking more about Sequential growth metric versus our traditional year over year trends. Jason will talk about All relevant details in his section. For now, as long as we are seeing contracted budgets for new Build's business, we will be adopting a 3 pronged approach to navigate the current environment. 1st, Pushing all possible efforts to address our current customers' most pressing tactical items, including the mix of engagement models, cost takeouts and consolidation priorities, while protecting our shareholder wallet and long term relationships, all possibly leading to low short term profitability metrics. 2nd, winning and quickly growing new business through increased focus on sales and GTM motions and partnerships, especially across those champions who would like to use The slow time to build a competitive advantage.

Speaker 2

Over the last 2, 3 quarters, our global business field organization and specialized practice teams We're focused on developing new offerings, new engagement models and new ways of working with our customers and have done so with some success and new momentum in the logo acquisition. We will still take some time to realize this larger revenue impact down the line, especially in the current economic climate. And 3rd, Continuously investing in our strategic priorities, which are staying in line with what we communicated before. Expansion of differentiated consulting agencies, data MLI and cloud capabilities building, improving our offering by delivering strategy and implementation simultaneously, expanding our engineering DNA across all strategic global delivery allocation, All in anticipation for the sharp return on demand for the Net Generation Transformation Services. With that, as part of our continuous investment strategy, I want to share some updates on our global delivery expansion programs.

Speaker 2

During the past quarter, we have made good progress in BOS, maintaining the level of delivery quality in Eastern and Central Europe and strengthening such quality in Central and Western Asia, where BOSGEOs benefited from integrating strong Kipam talent moving to many new locations across the regions. As part of our heritage and our core differentiation, Eastern and Central Europe delivery and most notably our Ukrainian operation will continue to be a cornerstone of our proposition. While we accelerate our investments in new center of excellence and while we continue to hire across our global footprint for higher demand skills. As part of the global delivery strategy, we continue to focus on building I would further our 2 currently fastest growing regions, India and Latin America. In addition to opening several new locations across those Geographies, we are happy to see sizable work streams starting and expanding there.

Speaker 2

And now not only from our existing clients, but also with brand new logos who are attracted by advantages demonstrated by EPAM in those regions. It's also important to mention The configuration of our client footprint in those still relatively new for us geographies now very much represents Our traditional client mix with some of our top 10 customers, but also new ones across multiple verticals from large corporations to technology platforms, firms and to software product companies. In our view, it's a very good illustration of the quality of the services we are delivering from the region, Conforming that continued investments into engineering excellence programs, education and integrated delivery platforms brings the results we expected to achieve today. Also with experience Over the past few years, we are now able to stand up new locations across EPAM global footprint in months versus years. By leveraging all elements of our digital platform ecosystem and strong talent acquisition capabilities.

Speaker 2

We believe during the next few years, we will be able to build the most geo balanced delivery talent platform on the market. To conclude, we believe that while we are experiencing and addressing accordingly very specific but still temporary challenges, Fundamentally, we are moving in the right direction. Our strategy for future accelerated growth is based on delivering complex business solution driven by advanced disruptive technology and quality engineering. Many of those solutions require unique alignment of consulting and implementation services and are specifically attracted to the client base consisting of leading global enterprises whose markets are driven and disrupted by Continuous Technological Transformation. We do believe that such enterprises will have to come back to Investments into technology builds component to lead and disrupt further their respectful markets and they will need partners like EPAM to progress.

Speaker 2

With that, I would like to pass to Jason to share more details and numbers for Q1 and for our changing outlook for the rest of the year.

Speaker 1

Thank you, Ark, and good morning, everyone. Before covering our Q1 results, I wanted to remind you that in addition to our customary non GAAP adjustments, Expenditures related to EPAM's management commitment to Ukraine and costs associated with the exit of our Russian operations, Business Continuity Resources and accelerated employee relocations have been excluded from non GAAP financial results. We have included additional disclosures specific to these and other related items in our Q1 earnings release. In the Q1, EPAM delivered solid results. The company generated revenue of $1,210,000,000 a year over year increase points.

Speaker 1

Additionally, the reduction in Russian customer revenues resulting from our decision to exit the market had a 220 basis point negative impact on revenue growth. Excluding Russia revenues, year over year revenue growth would have been 5.6% reported and over 7% on a constant currency basis. Beginning with our industry verticals, travel and consumer grew 4.9%, driven by solid growth in travel and hospitality and muted growth in retail. The ongoing exit of Russia operations also impacted growth in this vertical. Absent the impact growth would have been 6.7%.

Speaker 1

Financial Services grew 4.1% with strong growth coming from Asset Management and Insurance Services. Excluding Russia customer revenues, growth would have been 12.5%. Business Information and Media delivered 4.2% growth in the quarter. Software and High-tech produced no growth. The lack of growth in the quarter reflected a reduction in revenue from a former top 20 customer we mentioned during our Q4 earnings call and generally slower growth in revenues across a range of customers in the vertical.

Speaker 1

Life Sciences and Healthcare declined 10.1%. Growth in the quarter was impacted by the ramp down of a large transformational program mentioned during our Q4 earnings call. And finally, our emerging verticals delivered strong growth, of 14.7 percent driven by clients in Manufacturing, Automotive and Energy. From a geographic perspective, Americas, our largest region representing 59% of our Q1 revenues, grew 3.4% year over year or 4% in constant currency. EMEA representing 38% of our Q1 revenues grew 10% year over year was 13.3% in constant currency.

Speaker 1

CEE representing 1% of our Q1 revenues contracted 68.8 percent year over year or 70.8% in constant currency. Revenue in the quarter was impacted by our decision to exit our Russian operations and the resulting ramp down of services to Russia customers. And finally, APAC declined 9.4% year over year or 6.7% in constant currency terms And now represents 2% of our revenues. Revenue in the quarter was impacted primarily by the ramp down of work at a financial services client. In Q1, revenues from our top 20 clients grew 5.3% year over year, while revenues from clients outside our top 20 grew 2.3%.

Speaker 1

And moving down the income statement, our GAAP gross margin for the quarter was 29.3% compared to 33.4% in Q1 of last year. Non GAAP gross margin for the quarter was 31.5% compared to 33.3% for the same quarter last year. Gross margin in Q1 2023 reflects a negative impact of lower utilization and some year over year compression in account margins. GAAP SG and A was 17.5 percent of revenues compared to 20.3% in Q1 of last year. Non GAAP SG and A came in at 15.3 percent of revenues compared to 15.6% in the same period last year.

Speaker 1

Both GAAP and non GAAP SG and A expense in Q1 2023 include $9,500,000 in severance related expense incurred as the company works to better align its cost structure with the current demand environment. GAAP income from operations was $120,000,000 were 9.9 percent of revenue in the quarter compared to $129,000,000 or 11% of revenue in Q1 of last year. Non GAAP income from operations was $178,000,000 or 14.7 percent of revenue in the quarter compared to $189,000,000 or 16.1 percent of revenue in Q1 of last year. Our GAAP effective tax rate for the quarter came in at 19.6% versus our Q1 guide of 18%, primarily due to lower excess tax benefits related to stock based compensation. Our non GAAP effective tax rate, which excludes excess tax benefit was 22.9%.

Speaker 1

Diluted earnings per share on a GAAP basis was $1.73 Our non GAAP diluted EPS was $2.47 reflecting a dollars 0.02 decrease compared to the same quarter in 2022. In Q1, there were approximately 59,300,000 diluted shares outstanding. Turning to cash flow and our balance sheet. Cash flow from operations for Q1 was a positive $87,000,000 compared to a negative $52,000,000 in the same quarter of 2022. Q1 2022 cash flow was negatively impacted by an increase in DSO and the payment of a higher level of company wide variable compensation based on our 2021 performance.

Speaker 1

Free cash flow was $79,000,000 compared to a negative free cash flow of $75,000,000 in the same quarter last year. We ended the quarter with over 1 point $7,000,000,000 in cash and cash equivalents. At the end of Q1, DSO was 69 days and compares to 70 days for Q4 202269 days for the same quarter last year. Looking ahead, we expect DSO will remain steady throughout 2023. Now moving on to a few operational metrics.

Speaker 1

We ended Q1 with more than 51,100 consultants, designers, engineers, trainers and architects. Production headcount declined 7.1% compared to Q1 2022. The net decrease in headcount is a result of the reduction in Russia based headcount, a lower level of hiring across the organization and a largely completed program designed to produce modest levels of encouraged attrition. Our total headcount for quarter was more than 57,450 employees. Utilization was 74.9% compared to 78.4% in Q1 of last year and 73.6% in Q4 2022.

Speaker 1

Now let's turn to our business outlook. We're beginning to see the results of our focus on generating demand from new programs and customers. However, we are also seeing a continuation in the uneven demand environment that began in for 2022 and the global economic environment has not yet stabilized sufficiently to support client confidence. The demand environment continues to be characterized by slower decision making, caution around spending and program ramp downs due to uncertainty in certain client end markets. As a result, our overall level of demand is not improving sufficiently to support our initial revenue outlook.

Speaker 1

As highlighted during our Q4 earnings call, our operations in Ukraine have not been materially impacted and our teams remain highly focused on maintaining uninterrupted production. Our guidance assumes that we will continue to be able to deliver from our Ukraine delivery centers that productivity levels at were somewhat lower than those achieved in 2022. Consistent with previous cycles, we will continue to thoughtfully calibrate our expense levels, while investing in our capabilities and focusing on the preservation of our talent in preparation for a return of demand. We expect headcount will continue to decline somewhat in Q2 due to limited hiring and more typical attrition, and we will limit hiring in the second half until we see improving demand. We expect utilization in the mid-70s throughout the remainder of the year.

Speaker 1

As a reminder, the exit of our Russian operations and The reduction in Russia customer revenues produces a tougher year over year revenue comparison primarily in the first half of twenty twenty three. Moving to our full year outlook, we now expect revenue will be in the range of $4,950,000,000 to $5,000,000,000 reflecting a year over year growth rate of approximately 3%. On an organic constant currency basis, excluding the impact of the exit from Russia, we expect revenue growth to be just over 3%, both at the midpoint of the range. We're currently expecting sequential growth in both Q3 and Q4. However, we no longer expect to be able to generate double digit year over year growth in either quarter.

Speaker 1

We expect GAAP income from operations to continue to be in the range of 11.5% to 12.5% and non GAAP Income from operations to continue to be in the range of 15.5 percent to 16.5%. We expect Our GAAP effective tax rate to continue to be approximately 21%. Our non GAAP effective tax rate, which excludes excess tax benefits related to stock based compensation, will also continue to be 23%. For earnings per share, we expect that GAAP diluted EPS will now be in the range of $8.11 to $8.31 for the full year and non GAAP diluted EPS will now be in the range of $10.60 to $10.80 for the full year. We now expect weighted average share count of 59,400,000 fully diluted shares outstanding.

Speaker 1

Now moving to our Q2 2023 outlook, we expect revenues to be in the range of 1.195 to $1,205,000,000 producing a year over year growth rate of less than 1%. On an organic Constant currency basis, excluding the impact of the exit from Russia, we expect revenue growth to also be less than 1%, both at the midpoint of the range. For the Q2, we expect GAAP income from operations to be in the range of 10% to 11% and non GAAP income from operations to be in the range of 14% to 15%. We expect our GAAP effective tax rate to be approximately 20% and our non GAAP effective tax rate, which excludes excess tax benefits related to stock based compensation, to be approximately 23%. For earnings per share, we expect GAAP diluted EPS to be in the range of $1.82 to $1.90 for the quarter and non GAAP diluted EPS to be in the range of $2.38 to $2.46 for the quarter.

Speaker 1

We expect a weighted average share count of 59,400,000 diluted shares outstanding. Finally, a few key assumptions that support our GAAP to non GAAP measurements in the Q2 and remainder of the year. Stock based compensation expense expected to be approximately $6,000,000 for each of the remaining quarters. The impact of foreign exchange is expected to be negligible for the remainder of the year. Tax effective non GAAP adjustments is expected to be around $9,500,000 for Q2 $9,000,000 for each of the remaining quarters.

Speaker 1

We expect excess tax benefits to be around $6,000,000 for Q2, dollars 4,000,000 for Q3 and $2,000,000 for Q4. In addition to these customary GAAP to non GAAP adjustments, inconsistent with the prior quarter in 2022, we expect to have ongoing non GAAP adjustments in 2023, resulting from Russia's invasion of Ukraine. Please see our Q1 earnings release for a detailed reconciliation of our GAAP to non GAAP guidance. Finally, one more assumption outside of our GAAP to non GAAP items. With our significant cash position, we are generating a healthy level of interest income.

Speaker 1

We had expected an elevated level of interest income relative to past years when we developed our original full year guidance. However, due to the larger positive impact on EPS in 2023, we are updating our assumptions regarding interest income and making them explicit. For the remainder of the year, we expect interest income to be $8,000,000 for Q2 $7,000,000 for each of the remaining quarters. Lastly, I'd like to thank our employees for their continued dedication and focus on our customers. Operator, let's open the call for questions.

Operator

The first question will come from James Faucette with Morgan Stanley. Your line is open.

Speaker 3

Great. Thank you very much. Appreciate all the color and details so far this morning. It sounds like most of your revision and view for the rest of the year is attributable to Macroeconomic environment, just wondering if you can kind of give more detail on the underlying assumptions there. And I know back in the previous quarter, you had talked about that there was some engagement and reengagement that you need to do with Clients, I'm just wondering how that has gone and if that engagement and those kinds of conversations are impacting your outlook at all right now?

Speaker 4

Good morning, everybody. I think you're asking, because we were highlighting last quarter kind of 2 parallel trends. 1 of them concerns coming from Clients because of special conditions we are working and second was general slowdown in the economy. And so what is the main driver here? And I think definitely both of them were playing the role in our previous I think at this point, we definitely see the economy driving the behavior of the clients and the biggest impact on our guidance and fully cost and what's happening.

Speaker 4

And On top of this, if you remember, our previous guidance call was at the beginning of February and already at the beginning of March. We will always hear news from the banking sector from North America first and very quickly from Europe as well. And all of this is going to translate it to increased cost management's client, which was very visible. Specifically on the transformational programs, as I mentioned. So I think at this point, we believe general slowdown is more

Speaker 3

Got it. Thank you for that Art. And then I guess from the ramp downs and Softness, any sense of how much of that it sounds like you feel like that, that is probably Broad based, but any clarity on those ramp downs? And is that how much of that may be idiosyncratic to EPAM Given delivery challenges or it sounds like you think it's more really macro driven. I want to make sure I understand

Speaker 4

Yes, that's exactly what I said. And clearly, after our previous call, Some new things were happening and now you all were driven by

Operator

Please standby for our next question. Our next question comes from Darrin Peller with Wolfe Research. Your line is now open.

Speaker 5

Hey, thanks guys. If we could help just by maybe dissecting a little bit more around The demand environment versus what you're seeing that's more specific to some of the regions you're in now, some of the newer regions. And what I mean by that is really just whether or not there Anything that is tougher to execute from some of the new regions you've built into post Russia, post Ukraine, Or is that really not a factor and instead it's really just demand at the end of the day, you have all the talent you need executing the way you should. And then I guess a quick follow on related to that is just pricing dynamics to pass through. What's the latest The wage environment in those newer regions and how you're executing on that and your ability to pass through on pricing around that?

Speaker 4

I think that's what we were trying to bring, kind of the color during There is definitely like the economy acting like this, clients definitely reacting on this accordingly and the Cost and pricing and discounts all come into the play. And this is part of the life right now. It started several quarters ago as we were talking about it, but it's become very visible specifically today. That's exactly what we tried to highlight that we're executing kind of with multiple approaches. 1 of them, Yes, we do something which not necessarily our traditional approach.

Speaker 4

We try to Put ourselves in client's shoes. We're trying to understand what we can do and help in short term, actively Changes from models and focusing on the insurance that we maintain in relationship with the client and continuously service. So that's a big portion of what's happening today. So that's the answer to your question. While at the same time, there are still Transnational deals is still happening, not at the level which was like 12 months ago.

Speaker 4

And we're focusing on this and we continuously do this. And again, we have to do it in the future as we mentioned, but Definitely, cost pressure is here.

Speaker 1

So no real challenges in terms of delivery or the ability to add headcount or to get work done. But as Art said, it's really an issue of kind of the uncertain macro environment and clearly more uncertain

Speaker 4

than we expected by the

Speaker 1

time we kind of get to summer. And we think that's having an impact on customers' investment decisions. From a wage standpoint, we did do our promo campaign here in Q2. And as we talked about, we clearly were seeing wage inflation over the last year, but I think you're going to see a more muted wage Inflation environment through the remainder of the year.

Speaker 3

Yes.

Speaker 4

And then

Speaker 6

this

Speaker 1

pricing environment is clearly not one that is super supportive of price increases and we're finding both clients are cautious in terms Spend and in terms of rates and even sort of new engagements are requiring that we sort of sharpen our pencils a little bit.

Speaker 6

Just a very quick follow-up.

Speaker 5

You guys have always done a good job of having more visibility than most, and you try to take that into accounting guidance being conservative oftentimes. I mean, how do we feel about it now? I know you probably given the macro uncertainty wanted to take as much of this bad by being

Speaker 2

Listen,

Speaker 4

We understand what you're asking, but I think we reflect on exactly what we're seeing right now. Unfortunately, last quarter we were seeing this differently.

Speaker 6

Understood.

Speaker 4

And so the stability right now is very different like this is pretty new environment. I don't think we can compare this with Q2 of 2020. It was Different reaction of the clients, much more sharpened. So right now, it's different, but yes, that's what we see. And I think everybody need to think about quarter by quarter adjustments right now because That's what will be the next quarter.

Speaker 6

Okay, understood. Thanks, Art. Thanks, Jason.

Operator

Please standby for our next question. The next question comes from Bryan Bergin with T. B. Cowen, your line is open.

Speaker 7

Hi, guys. Good morning. Thank you for taking the questions. First one is a follow-up on budget behavior. So I'm curious if you're seeing clients caught and outright cancel programs or if this is more so Deferral and delay of spend, so more like a wait and see approach.

Speaker 7

I'm trying to understand if there is potential pent up recovery that could actually form later this year

Speaker 8

Or if the potential budget dollars

Speaker 7

are more or less out for 2023?

Speaker 4

I think we also try to indicate how we're thinking about it. And based on what we saw in our previous slides, Based on what we think happening with technology right now, We mentioned that you're thinking in terms of quarters, but that's a question how many quarters, 2, 3, 4 quarters, Not in terms of years when the market will restore. That's our belief that we're making mistakes as everybody else. But in this case, still the same, quarters versus years.

Speaker 1

And so we saw those couple of ramp downs that we talked about, which 1 in the healthcare space and 1 in the tax space. And those were largely, not largely, they were very much sort of economy based, a client making a decision Just based on kind of how they were looking at their future revenues and profits, what we're seeing today It's more kind of, let's say, a trimming or adjustment to spend, which is generally a contraction. So Brian, it's not People saying, hey, look, I'm not going to do any more work. It's just people sort of reducing their spend. And as Ark said, eventually, we think that, that People have returned to a need to make the investments to make their businesses competitive and successful in the future.

Speaker 4

And it's definitely a combination across all of this and when somebody telling you that we will delay For 1 quarter, we will start next quarter and then next quarter, as I said, we have to do it for another quarter and when this happens for several, then Okay. That's not a consolation, but it's definitely not allowing us to count.

Speaker 7

Okay. That's helpful. Okay. And then just shifting over to margin here. So can you just Talk about and any update around your thoughts on structural margin as the business does recover?

Speaker 7

And then near term levers to balance the profitability and the global Just trying to get a sense on how you're expecting gross margin really to trend forward?

Speaker 1

Yes. So I think with the updated guidance is that We're probably thinking that utilization is going to remain more in the mid-70s rather than the high-70s in the second half. However, we do have characteristics in the second half, which generally the higher bill days in Q3, the Social Security caps and a little bit of trend up in utilization. So I am expecting that gross margin will be maybe somewhere around the 33% for the second half. SG and A and other areas of variable expense, we're definitely working to control.

Speaker 1

And so SG and A will likely be below 15% as a percentage of revenue. And then what we're looking to do is still run the business at sort of close to 16% for the full year. But what that means is the second half will probably be closer to our the top end of our traditional 16% to 17% range.

Speaker 9

Okay. Thank you.

Operator

Please standby for the next question. The next question comes from David

Speaker 6

I wonder if I could just go back to a question that was asked a little bit earlier. If I look at your guidance for the year, just take the midpoint of about $5,000,000,000 it looks like You are kind of guiding to sequential increases in revenue in the back half of the year. I think, Ark, you said you're guiding to what you see. So does that imply that you have some visibility on backlog or new ramps That give you confidence that revenue growth will kind of accelerate sequentially in the back half of the year?

Speaker 4

I think we are seeing programs which Starting to show up in conversations And based on this, we think we'll moderate increase in demand, especially like If you think about how much technology potentially changing as we speak a lot of experimentation starting So that's how we'll get right now for the Page 2. Yes. It will be moderate increase.

Speaker 1

Yes. And despite obviously the guidance for Q2 and some of the growth figures you see in the top 20 and the below top 20s, we are seeing a Significant amount of new logo activity. So there's a fair number of wins, a lot of new MSAs being signed. The challenge right now, David, is that most of those new programs are relatively small. And so they're not contributing to the same extent Revenue growth as they might have in the past years, but we are sort of hopeful that they'll grow over time.

Speaker 1

And then just a quick comment on the growth rates that we saw with the Top 20 and the below top 20 is with the movement of clients between those cohorts and particularly the 2 clients we've talked about In Technology and Healthcare, when they move from the top 20 to out of the top 20, it tends to distort the growth rates, particularly in the below top 20. And so that's why we're seeing a somewhat lower level of growth outside our top 20 clients.

Speaker 6

Got it. And just to go back to your comments, I guess, 90 days ago, when you I think you talked about A client that shifted a workload to another vendor and you just really didn't get notification, I guess, until late last year. Have you seen any other major clients shift workloads to other vendors over the course of the last 90 days or Any activity that would suggest that's still a possibility this year?

Speaker 4

I don't think we saw due to the last 90 days, specifically, as we saw more delays and more Delays of the decisions and delays with the status of programs which we were At the same time, there is a pretty big consolidation efforts across the industry. And specifically consolidation efforts versus pricing and cost cuts cost kind of So It could be impact across the portfolio in this area for sure.

Speaker 6

So just to be clear, Arkin?

Speaker 4

This is a whole part of the pressure. That's exactly what we I tried to explain this morning that when transformational programs unfolds, What's becoming the main driver, we will know it. And there is redistribution of the budgets in the results. But Again, that's why we show the snappers which we show. On another side, it's critically Important and that's what we believe that we did.

Speaker 4

Now both quarters, the situation will be changing and we Many times we have seen how this redistribution of work were coming back because then you need like actually to deliver, Deliver with the quality and deliver on new technologies and this is Jason. We unfortunately have to share our projections Right now as it is exactly because of this, because of cost situation and many decisions which clients

Operator

Please standby for our next question. The next question comes from Maggie Nolan with William Blair. Your line is now open.

Speaker 10

Thank you. Jason, you started to get into this a little bit, but you've mentioned in past quarters that new client additions were kind of a big focus area for the sales force for 2023 after Focusing more on delivery in 2022, is that still an area that you're really focused on investing into for 2023 or is that sort of changing alongside the demand environment?

Speaker 1

No, that continues to be a really significant focus Right. So in addition to maintaining the existing relationships and growing in existing accounts, there's a huge focus on new logo activity. And just the only challenge right now in past years, you might have initiated a new relationship and seen 1,000,000 of dollars of revenue In the Q1 and maybe over $10,000,000 in the second or third. And right now, just people are more cautious about their budgets, so that the relationships are starting with kind of Smaller projects, but I think over the period of quarters may take into 2024. I think a number of these new relationships are going to produce Growth and I think it will begin to show up in our numbers.

Speaker 1

And at the same time and I think I talked with some of you kind of face to face We got a little bit of a 2 steps forward, 1 step back scenario where we are having some of the larger clients Not just a continued relationship or shift work to another vendor, but what they are doing is they're trimming their budgets. And so While we get some of these incremental revenues from new clients, then we also have these offsets that are coming from larger clients that Looking to sort of trim their spend and that's kind of the behavior that we see in Q2 and was more pronounced than we had expected when we guided in February.

Speaker 10

Okay. And then can you comment on how much of a priority M and A is right now or share repurchase?

Speaker 1

Yes. So M and A continues to be a priority. As always, we want to make certain that we're acquiring assets that we think can be integrated successfully and will help us sort of drive and evolve our business. And so we have active discussions going on today. I can't comment, but we're going to close when, but certainly we've got some active conversations occurring and you likely would see something in the future.

Speaker 1

And then from a share buyback standpoint, we did initiate our program In Q1, it was modest, less than $10,000,000 bought back, I think 30,000 shares. And I would expect that we would Continue to move forward with participation, although we don't have the predetermined level for Q2, but expect to be active terms of share buybacks in the quarter.

Speaker 4

And on M and A, I would add that It's pretty much same approach we have before. We're looking for things which is Longer term, more strategic and there is no any specific efforts to Make situation better for the short term. So it's all about longer term and what will be happening In the year 'twenty two, there's a benefit.

Speaker 10

Okay. Thanks, Ark. Thanks, Jason.

Operator

Please standby for our next question. The next question comes from Ramsey El Assal with Barclays. Your line is now open.

Speaker 11

Hi. Thanks for taking my question. This morning, I wanted to ask about the some comments you made about clients Obviously shifting to more kind of cost takeout focused work, how much of an internal pivot is required for you to address and meet that shifting demand. Do you have to reskill or invest or is it just Does it take time to get there? Or is it just a matter of you have the skills on hand, you just have to sort of change the orientation a little bit in terms of kind of getting there with your clients?

Speaker 4

So we do believe we have Again, as you know, as we communicated, it's not a primary focus of for our services lines. So but at the same time, we have the skills we are building In terms of organization, we have people who understand what to do in this area. And from technology skills, In some situations, we have definitely capabilities to apply this for Cost out engagements. So we put in our efforts around it. I don't think it's about Specific risk killing or anything else.

Speaker 4

It's still even with this effort is relatively a small portion of what we Doing in general, there is no goal to repurpose company for this type of occasions. So this is much more tactical effort for us. Those quarters which we believe This type of trend will be happening before the market will come back. So we still invest in a very specific area for the future growth.

Speaker 11

Okay. And could you also provide a little more color on the pipeline right now?

Speaker 2

Has there

Speaker 11

been a shift to any particular type of deal large versus small? Is it more new logo versus expansion?

Speaker 1

Are there easier Is there a path

Speaker 11

of least resistance there? How is the composition of the pipeline evolving?

Speaker 1

I mean, there are still A handful of large deals that are out there, they were expected to generate revenues in the second half that are significant Mainframe to cloud type engagements that will have significant revenues, but and I think we talked about this in the last conference call as well, which is that Most of the new work that we're seeing is generally smaller in size. There are relatively fewer clients who are kicking off large scale transformation programs at this time. They're looking for kind of near term return on their investment. They're looking for modifications, updates To existing platforms rather than sort of creating new platforms. And again, it's back to the Let's say the instability in the macroeconomic view is long as people aren't certain whether the bottom is going to be in Q3 or Q4 or Q1 of 2024, It just makes it more difficult for people to have make investments in larger scale transformation programs.

Speaker 11

Got it. Thanks so much.

Operator

Please standby for the next question. The next question comes from Ashwin Shirvaikar with Citi. Your line is now open.

Speaker 9

Thank you. Good morning, folks. Ark, I appreciated the thoughtful comments at the top of the call. First question though is to Jason. Is the idea, Jason, to hold the line on Operating margins, because you kind of mentioned quarter to quarter variability and the need to be flexible based on revenues, You know, not having visibility into revenues.

Speaker 9

So is that the idea that you will hold the line on margins?

Speaker 1

Yes. So our focus continues to be on a return to stronger demand over some period of time as Art talked about whether that's 2 or 3 or 4 quarters, and to make sure that we're making investments in the business that will allow us to continue to advance our capabilities and be successful in the market. And at the same time, we are being very careful in terms of spending, really addressing discretionary costs, Controlling anything that's more variable in nature and Ashwin trying to drive the business at least to the to do it around a 16% or maybe slightly below that range. So trying to maintain profitability throughout the year at 16%. And what you'll find then is that the second half will have stronger profitability just because there are characteristics that make gross margin stronger.

Speaker 1

And then with continued focus on SG and A I expect that SG and A will go below 15%. So again, it will be focused on the longer term, so we don't want to do anything that hinders ourselves to return to growth. And at the same time, we want to be careful about our discretionary spending.

Speaker 9

Understand. And as it sort of relates The portfolio of services and your delivery, do your clients, particularly the older more The more tenured clients, do they all understand at this point that you have a more diversified delivery than Or that is not primarily 3 center and East European countries Or does that come up as a factor? And I just want to also clarify from Ark, Is there an intent here to get into things like application management and so on more deeply broaden out

Speaker 4

So this is what we do As we speak, at the same time, okay, let's from the beginning. First of all, absolutely, clients understand that we have a different delivery kind of structure today. So that's what also I was talking this morning about that we've been in new clients and existing clients coming to New geographies which they didn't experience with the past before. And we have pretty good progress because it's not already like 1 or 2 quarters, it's already almost like 18 months. And we have new clients, which is very typical clients as which is driving for engineering differentiation and technology services, which come into new locations with us as well and appreciate the differentiation which we show as that because again, as I mentioned, The direction was taken even before it was started for Globalization of our services and investments were done in different regions for some time.

Speaker 4

First of all, India, but then very actively in Latin America as well. Plus there are new geographies for us like Central Western Asia, which is benefited strongly from the talent coming from our traditional Historical locations as well, so which is a little bit more predictable from this point of view for clients too because Some projects moved there because of the targets moving there as well. So from this point of view, there is no use for everybody, everybody at this direction. So from the portfolio of the business, definitely we do more new We also were growing over the U. S.

Speaker 4

Application management component as well, but it's still relatively Small portion of what we do and it's addition usually in addition to transformational work which we do. As soon as we do a big Modernization, we've taken on increasing components of publication management as well, but Still focused on transformation program as I mentioned. What we're seeing right now is that they delayed and we do believe that while Q2 definitely was impacted, I think some of them will start to be realizing in H2 and that's why we believe that it would be some growth there because There are too many programs. We don't believe that clients will be able to afford to delay them for a long time. They already Delayed there for multiple quarters.

Speaker 4

So I think it's it will

Speaker 9

Understood. Thank you, Khaled.

Operator

Please standby for the next question. The next question comes from Jason Kupferberg with Bank of America. Your line is open.

Speaker 8

Good morning, Ark and Jason. This is Tyler Dupont on for Jason. Thanks for taking the question. I know I'm putting a lot of time, so I'll be trying to be I think you briefly touched on this, but maybe just to ask it in a different way and just to clarify on my end, if you could spend a bit of time talking about the linearity of the quarter. For example, The last print was in the 2nd week of February and at that time, you talked about some positive green shoots.

Speaker 8

Did the demand picture fall off significantly in March particularly? And if so, is that fully attributable to the banking sector crisis? Or just any clarity there would be helpful.

Speaker 4

So I think we do believe that the news of the market was impacting a lot of decisions. And it's not necessarily impacted Just back in our financial services, but most of the other industries put a lot of progress on hold. And you can see what's happening like this announcement of other technology driven companies due to the last couple of months. So this is all part of the same very Kind of sharp reaction of the situation. For the for the services which we provided.

Speaker 4

And I've provided that this is majority, big majority of what we do.

Speaker 8

Okay, great. Thanks a lot. I appreciate that. And then just as a follow-up, it seems like while financials and travel seem to put up I was a little bit more surprised to see the life sciences and to a lesser degree, high-tech experienced a bit of a slowdown. So just wondering if you could parse out what you're seeing in those verticals, like how much of that decline, for example, was from the ramp down of those large clients Mentioned on the last call compared to, I guess, as Jason described, more of a trimming of spend across the client base?

Speaker 1

Yes. So quickly on the Life Sciences Healthcare, it's largely a significant sort of ramp down and specifically They put a program they effectively sort of ended a program and have kind of restarted some work, but not Specific to that program and there's been a very significant difference in the revenues we generated last year from that client from the revenues we expect will generate this year. And then from a Hy Tech standpoint, again, you've got the one client, but then you also just have a generalized kind of slowdown in spend As I think we all see in the news from the high-tech sector.

Speaker 4

And if you will, this is in some ways Could be sometimes accidental or driven by a couple of clients, but in some ways, very logical industries, if you think, because Software and High-tech, more obvious, life science, if you think how much investment was done there Due to the COVID time and how much all the investment was done and that with current situation, Subfix should be done and a lot of thinking should be done where investment were put. So I think it's a lot of thinking inside of life science industry right now after

Operator

At this time, I would now like to turn the call back to Ark for closing remarks.

Speaker 4

Thank you again for joining us. Yes. It's unusual period in our kind of life after Significant growth and now seeing a little bit different world. But again, our belief that technology will be driving The future, we didn't talk too much about all this nice conversation about OpenAI, But we do believe that a lot of engagement digital ecosystem will have to be rebuilt very, very soon And it will be inclined for competition and those who would like to drive the future will come to us for help as well. So Thank you.

Speaker 4

I'll talk to you in 3 months.

Operator

This concludes today's conference call. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.

Remove Ads
Powered by Quartr
Earnings Conference Call
EPAM Systems Q1 2023
00:00 / 00:00
Remove Ads