Infosys Q3 23/24 Earnings Call Transcript

Quartr
Provided by Quartr
January 11, 2024

There are 12 speakers on the call.

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Infosys Earnings Conference Call. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Sandeep Mahendru. Thank you and over to you, sir.

Speaker 1

Hello, everyone, and welcome to Infosys earnings call for Q3 FY 'twenty four. Let me start by wishing everyone a very happy New Year. Joining us on this call is CEO and MD, Mr. Salil Parekh CFO, Mr. Nilandjan Roy and other members of the leadership team.

Speaker 1

Will start the call with some remarks on the performance of the company for Q3, subsequent to which we'll open up the call for questions. Participants please note that anything we say that refers to our outlook for the future is a forward looking statement that must be read in conjunction with the risks that the company faces. A full statement and explanation of these risks is available in our filings with the SEC, which can be found on www.sec.gov. I'd now like to pass on the call to Salil.

Speaker 2

Thanks, Ambit. Good evening and good morning to everyone on the call. Wish you a Happy New Year. Our Q3 revenue declined by 1% quarter on quarter and 1% year on year in constant currency terms. For the 1st three quarters, our revenue grew by 1.8% over the same period last year in constant currency.

Speaker 2

We see lower traction for digital transformation programs and more activity for cost and efficiency programs and increasing interest in generative AI programs. Our operating margin was at 20.5%. We delivered this outcome while managing through one off business disruptions. Nilanjan will provide more detail for this. Large deals were at $3,200,000,000 71% of this was net new.

Speaker 2

This included 1 mega deal. With this, our large deal value for the 1st 3 quarters stands at $13,200,000,000 of which 55% is net new. This is the highest ever large deal value for the 1st 3 quarters in the fiscal year for us. Participants We see that with our large deal wins, we continue to win market share and strengthen our position through our leading capabilities in helping clients with cost, efficiency automation programs and by leveraging generative AI, digital and cloud. We have seen impact in Financial Services, Telco and High-tech segments.

Speaker 2

We see participants are seeing strong traction for generative AI programs leveraging our Topaz capability, we've integrated our generative AI components into our service line portfolio, creating impact for our clients. We have 100,000 employees trained in generative AI areas. We've developed a range of use cases and benefit scenarios across different industries for our clients. Some of these areas are related to client analytics, process optimization, sales, are in the process of marketing, knowledge analysis, software development, self-service and personalization. Some examples of the work we're doing in these areas.

Speaker 2

We are working with a large global bank to support them in their risk analysis program by using a large language model for them. We are working with the global food supplier to personalize food experience for their customers and to make their operations efficient using artificial intelligence. We're working with a global retail company are in defining their AI first business transformation strategy. Our clients are leveraging all these generative AI capabilities in Topaz, combined with the cloud capabilities in Cobalt to help them navigate through this current business environment and setting up for the future. Our margin improvement program continues to gain traction.

Speaker 2

The 5 pillars, the large organization mobilization and steady execution are creating impact. Based on the performance in the 1st 3 quarters and our outlook for Q4, we are tightening our revenue growth guidance for financial year 2024 to 1.5% to 2% in constant currency. Our operating margin guidance for financial year 2024 remains unchanged at 20% to 22%. As you probably know, Nilanjan is leaving Infosys at the end of this financial year. I want to thank Nilanjan for the excellent work he has done and the strong position he has put Infosys in.

Speaker 2

In addition, I also want to thank him for his partnership and his friendship over the past several years, we wish him all the best in his future plans. With that, let me hand it over to Nilanjan.

Speaker 3

Thanks, Alil. Good evening, everyone, and thank you for joining the call. Coming to our Q3 results, revenues declined by 1% year on year in constant currency, sequentially revenues similarly declined by 1% in constant currency and 1.2% in dollar terms. This includes the impact of furloughs and one offs. Volumes remain soft coupled with seasonality and normalization of one time revenues we had in Q2, while the overall environment remains subdued, our large deal TCV is highest ever on a YTD basis.

Speaker 3

I will talk about the large deals in more detail. Revenue for 9 months increased by 1.8% in constant currency and 2.5% in USD terms. We are making steady progress on Project Maximus, the margin improvement plan across 5 pillars and over 20 tracks. This strengthens our confidence that the program will give us the impetus for margin expansion over time. Operating margins for Q2 were 20.5%, a decline of 70 basis points sequentially, bringing the 9 months margins are subject to 20.8%, which is within the guidance plan for the year.

Speaker 3

The major components of Q on Q margin work for Q3 margin are as follows. There are headwinds of 130 basis points comprising of 70 basis points from salary increases effective 1st November, are in the range of 60 basis points from McCamish cyber incident, which had an impact on both revenue and costs. This was partially offset by tailwinds of 60 basis points comprising of fifty basis points benefit from cost optimization, including high utilization and low SG and A, ten basis points from currency movement. Balance includes impacts of furloughs offset by higher lead utilization and a one off benefits including lower provision for post sales client support and lower ECL model losses, Headcount at the end of the quarter stood at 322,000 employees, a decline of 1.9% from the previous quarter, which is reflected in improvement in utilization to 82.7 percent excluding trainees. On-site mix also improved by 20 basis points sequentially to 24.4.

Speaker 3

As mentioned earlier, we continue to improve our operating efficiencies. LTM attrition for Q3 reduced further by 1.7% to 12.9%. Free cash flow for the quarter was robust at $665,000,000 and the conversion to net profit for Q3 was strong at 90.6%. Unbilled revenues dropped for the 3rd consecutive quarter and consequently this has partly led to an increase in DSO by 5 days sequentially to 72 days. Consolidated cash and equivalents stood at $3,900,000,000 at the end of the quarter after a dividend payout of 895,000,000 EPS declined by 6.1% in INR on a year on year basis and grew by 3% in INR for the 9 months period ended.

Speaker 3

Yield on cash balances was 6.9% in Q3, ROE improved to 31.8%. Large deal momentum continued and deal TCV of Q3 was $3,200,000,000 with 71% net new. Consequently, our large deal TCV is over $13,000,000,000 which is the highest ever for any comparative period. This clearly reinforces our position and strengthens the relevance and strength of our service offerings. We signed 23 large deals in Q3, including 1 mega deal.

Speaker 3

We signed 8 deals in manufacturing, 6 in FS, 4 in EURS, 2 each in Retail and Communication and 1 in Others. Region wise, we signed 10 large deals in America, 9 in Europe and 3 in ROW and 1 in India. Participants are in the range of 2nd quarters. Inflation, uncertain macro and delayed decision making continues to impact the financial services sector. With increasing cost pressures, clients remain cautious on spending and are reprioritizing their programs to deliver maximum business value.

Speaker 3

Topaz is central to our generative AI discussions, which is gaining momentum and use cases around improving customer experience. We also started implementing use cases in some of our clients, focusing on improving client experiences, detecting fraud, etcetera. Overall, while the near term outlook remains volatile, we will benefit from the recent deal wins and the new account openings. Clients in communication sector continues to face growth challenges, which is putting pressure on OpEx spend. Uncertainty about medium term spends remain with clients, prioritizing cost optimization and vendor consolidation.

Speaker 3

Clients are looking at conserving cash, are visible in delayed decision making and project deferrals. Our focus on large and mega deals resulted in healthy pipeline and deal wins. Energy, Utilities, Resources and Services clients remain cautiously optimistic about the demand environment with cap and short term spend. In Energy segment, we are seeing market share gains due to consolidation. Our investment on Industry Cloud Solutions and the Energy Transition combined with extreme focus on human experience have helped us differentiate, win multiple deals and build a strong pipeline.

Speaker 3

Manufacturing segment continues to deliver strong performance on the back are in the near

Speaker 2

areas like

Speaker 4

digital, cloud, data and

Speaker 3

IoT. Pipeline remains healthy with emerging opportunities on various fronts in the ER and D space resulting from increased are spending. In the Retail segment, cost takeouts and consolidation remain the primary focus for the clients. While discretionary spends remain under pressure, there are pockets of the opportunities leveraging generative AI in predictive analysis, real term insights and decision support areas. Deal pipeline is strong, though decision cycles remain long.

Speaker 3

Are in the early quarter and the continued momentum in deal wins coupled with a very large efficient execution engine gives us confidence for growth in the medium term. Driven by our YTD growth of 1.8% in CC terms and Q4 outlook, we have revised our revenue growth guidance for FY 2024 from 1% to 2.5% previously to 1.5% to 2% in constant currency terms. We retain our margin guidance band for the year at 20% to 22 Finally, I would personally like to thank all the stakeholders of Infosys, especially the fabulous finance team here for their support over the past 5 years. Participants have a step down, I look forward to working closely with the entire leadership team over the next few months to ensure a smooth transition. Participants Finally, I wish Jairish the very best as he assumes the role of CFO from 1st Wave Bill 'twenty 4.

Speaker 3

With that, we can open up the call for questions.

Operator

Participants thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. The first question is from the line of Kumar Rakesh from BNP Paribas. Please go ahead.

Speaker 5

Hi, good evening and thank you for taking my question. My first question was

Operator

Can I request you to speak up a bit?

Speaker 5

Sure. Is this better?

Operator

Yes. Go ahead, please.

Speaker 5

Thank you. So my first question was around the new deal wins, which has been pretty strong at $2,300,000,000 It's among the highest we have seen in the recent quarters. However, that also implies the renewals have been weaker. In the recent quarters, we have seen renewals to be in the range of $1,500,000,000 to $2,000,000,000 In this quarter, it was less than $1,000,000,000 And that could also be the reason for slowdown in the second half, which you are expecting. We can understand that the new deal wins would be lumpy and difficult to predict, but you would have a time line on the renewals When they would be happening and what is the probability that you could see winning them back.

Speaker 5

So how do you see the next

Speaker 3

I think

Speaker 2

my reading of the new of the large deals win is more along the lines that We are continuing to do well with renewals and then we've got really excellent net new wins in the 3,200,000,000 as we have discussed at other times, the large deals By themselves, the numbers vary quarter on quarter. As you know, last quarter was also extremely large number. Participants Having said that, we have on the renewals a clear sight of what's coming up. We're also benefiting in many of these areas From consolidations, which Nilanjan referenced and also where we are seeing our clients are seeing opportunities for cost and efficiency. So all of that gets combined with the renewals coming along at regular cycles.

Speaker 4

Participants Got it.

Speaker 5

Thanks for that. And my second question was around Jenei. So you have talked about are being trained on JNAI, but can you quantify or share some insights on the client engagement side? Anything that you can quantify number of projects that we are working or the amount of deals that we are winning, anything that we can start tracking on that side?

Speaker 2

So there we are not at this stage sharing externally any views on revenues or projects and so participants To give you color, what is happening today is almost Every discussion with clients involves some element of generative AI. And what we have now developed through Topaz have a large number of clients on those in different scales, where there are some which are more pilots, some which are programs And that's the three examples that I shared. We've also developed strength across A number of large language models where we've trained our teams And then on how to leverage datasets, our focus is very much on large enterprises who are our clients and the data sets within those enterprises depending on the usage of where that large language model is to be applied and we have a very strong business in data and analytics, which becomes the foundation for this generative AI work and then we are working to make sure that the benefits are felt across all of our service offerings. So we can start to see in new discussions with clients, productivity benefits, which are downstream coming from this generative ad. So at this stage, while we are not externally quantifying all of the elements I referenced, that's the sort of color we are seeing across a large number of discussions.

Speaker 5

Participants Thanks for that, Salil.

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Nitin Padmanabhan from Investec. Please go ahead.

Speaker 4

Hi, good evening. Thanks for the opportunity. Congrats on the strong deal wins. So I think, first off, Saleel, anything that you have seen Versus the previous quarter in terms of client behavior, that's our Board sort of suggests green shoots on the discretionary side? Or do you think that will continue to be under pressure for some time.

Speaker 4

The second question is for Nalunjan. It appears that we'll exit the year with margins lower than last year. Do you still believe that margins will be better next year versus the current one. We have sort of highlighted that as sort of an aspiration at the beginning of the year. So just wanted your thoughts on how one should think of that at this point in time?

Speaker 4

Thank you.

Speaker 2

Participants Thanks. Hi, this is Salil. In terms of the client discussions, we have not seen Some sort of significant change in one or the other direction from what we were seeing last quarter. So some of the digital transformation work or some of that type of programs clients are not putting focus or attention, whereas the cost and the efficiency and now even consolidation, we are seeing more and more of that, which is what we were seeing last quarter as well. So in that sense, we don't have any change that we have sensed At this stage.

Speaker 3

So, Nitin, on the margin question, I think you've seen this quarter as well, the underlying margins, including the one offs, are quite resilient. And we've talked about now Project Maximus. This is nearly the 3rd quarter. And there's a lot of work have been going on and we are seeing the benefits of that and you can see that in our commentary as well and we are very confident about the overall margin outlook. We won't give a number about next year, but really the multiple number of tracks around value based selling, around Efficient Pyramid, around automation and GenAI, I think they're all working well.

Speaker 3

So I think that gives us good optimism over the medium term in terms of our margin structure.

Speaker 4

Participants Perfect. Thank you so much and all the best.

Operator

Thank you. Next question is from the line of Moshe Katri from Wedbush Securities. Please go ahead.

Speaker 6

Hey, thanks for taking my questions and Congrats on strong business for the quarter. First question, any color on the ongoing budget cycle for calendar 24? Do you think budgets will be on time. Do you think budgets will be delayed? Any color there on that one?

Speaker 2

Thanks, Moshe. This is Salil. On the budgets, we have seen first, As we saw our Q3 end of the year quarter, the furloughs were in play. We're seeing that are coming into play in the Q1 calendar year, so our Q4. The budget decisions are ongoing and as you know, well, these will go through the early part of this month.

Speaker 2

So nothing from that, but we don't see any change in what we were seeing in terms of behavior from the last quarter where budgets would suddenly have a different direction. So at this stage, looks Like it's similar to what we were seeing, but everything is not yet closed out from our discussions on the budget.

Speaker 7

Understood. And then looking at

Speaker 6

the deal flow, the large deal flow that went through calendar 23, there were some concerns that they're not are converting, so these are not converting on a timely basis. Has that changed in any way in terms of conversion some of these deals? And When we could start seeing that inflection point in revenue growth because of those deals converting? Thanks a lot.

Speaker 1

On that,

Speaker 2

where we see the revenue flowing, Again, as you remember, the large deals obviously giving us the foundation, especially the net new and renewal for future revenue. And at the same time, we're also seeing impact where the digital programs are not moving or digital programs sometimes are being stopped. So that combination is what gives that revenue outcome. At this stage, participants We have no specific sort of external view on what will happen In the quarter, but overall revenue guidance for this financial year, which is only 1 more quarter gives you a sense of how we are feeling about that. Participants We will see because a lot of the large deals as they start to build up and when sort of the digital capabilities start to have a more sort of interest with clients, we will start to see that change, I'm sure.

Operator

The next question is from the line of Pankaj Rudra from JPMorgan Chase.

Speaker 4

Hi, thank you. Salil, could you elaborate on what you've seen the client spending sentiment has been A, on projects that have already been signed, let's say, in the last 9 months or so on the cost takeout side participants are on incremental signing of smaller projects because we can see on large projects, but we don't have a visibility on how your small projects are doing.

Speaker 2

Sure. So on the client spending, where clients have signed recently in the last 3, 6, 9 months that spending is going well both on cost and other projects, incremental projects, as you were describing, on things that were more in the past, participants That behavior on the cost has continued and the incremental projects we have seen even in the past quarter some impact. But what has been signed recently, we see those proceeding as per what they've signed.

Speaker 4

Understood. I mean, I think you've mentioned several times on the call that there seems to be delays in revenue recognition because of project reprioritization. Is there a way of maybe estimating this for our benefit for investors benefit? Like for example, how much of fiscal 'twenty over the last 2 years total contract value signings may have been impacted because of change in client priorities all alternatively, how much of the signings have been shrinking every quarter? Does it be one back with new project signings for you to stay at the same place?

Speaker 2

Participants So we are not in a position to share that externally. We have a view on what we look at in terms of wins, execution and large deals internally. There are also other programs, some small, some mid sizes, which go up and down. And so that whole internal competition is something which we work with, but it's not something which we have in the past are going even today sharing externally.

Speaker 4

I understand. I wanted to color it as opposed to maybe a quantification.

Speaker 2

Participants Yeah. So same, I think at this stage, the outcome is what We have not given any more on that in terms of color as well, Ankur.

Speaker 4

Understood. Maybe moving to margins, just one question. Obviously, this quarter, if I take out the impact of the ransomware incident, it appears that margins would have been up by 60 basis points. Is that right? Number 1.

Speaker 4

Number 2, if you could elaborate where we are on the various project MAXIMUS levers And where is the remaining support, let's say, over the next year or so?

Speaker 3

Participants Yes. So we've given the margin walk in the initial script and quite clear about the one offs, the salary, etcetera. From Overall, MAXIMUS, like I said, there are a lot of tracks which are currently in play. Utilization is one you're seeing impact. That's the biggest one straight on the pyramid, a lot of work there on-site, offshore.

Speaker 3

This is the first time we've seen some positive movement after a lot of quarters. On automation and Gen AI, a lot of work going on now with Gen AI coming in with additional sort of levers available to us more than the traditional automation which we used to do. Pricing has been much better. There's a lot of work happening on value based selling. And in fact, that's also reflected RPP that we are seeing a much more stable pricing underlying pricing regime and That's something which we are pushing on.

Speaker 3

So I think all the levers are in play. We have quarters where we are able to squeeze more and many new ideas, I think, with project MAXIMUS, which have come into the fray as well looking at large programs and whether we can early on get into and I think we've already seen the early results.

Speaker 4

A quick follow-up if I can. There is

Speaker 1

some concern that some of

Speaker 4

the cost takeout contracts won in the last 9 months may drive some margin headwinds. Is that something that should impact on a portfolio basis next year?

Speaker 3

That's something we've always talked about. We have a portfolio of contracts in the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th year, Right. So there are while new contracts come in, which are initially potentially at lower margins, at the same time we have contracts Rajag has been going into a steady state. Some of these questions were raised 2, 3 years back in one of our segments as well. And you've seen the improvement in that segment, particularly over the period of time, where it's nearly closer to the average margin for the company.

Speaker 3

So that's something which is participants, some of which we've really fine tuned and mastered over the few years. So in that sense, that's always built into our projections and forecasts.

Speaker 4

Appreciate the color. Thank you and best of luck.

Operator

Next question is from the line of Bryan Bergin from TD Cowen. Please go ahead.

Speaker 8

Hi, good evening. Thank you. First question I have is demand by geography. Can you talk about pipeline and client spending plans across The U. S.

Speaker 8

Versus Europe, maybe also based on what you have in backlog. I'm curious if you think the recent trend of North America weakness being offset by solid Europe performance is likely to continue or whether that may change as you go through fiscal 2025?

Speaker 4

Participants

Speaker 2

Thanks, Vissaleel. On the geography, as you point out, we had Good growth in Europe in Q3, weaker in North America outcome. In terms of pipeline, we don't share the pipeline split by geography. We do see large deals that Nilanjan shared by geography in good momentum, at least on the large deals on both U. S.

Speaker 2

And European side, but we don't sort of specifically call out pipeline Our outlook by geography within our business.

Speaker 8

Okay. Any reason that the current growth trajectory should change near term or should it remain somewhat consistent?

Speaker 2

So there if you look at, you know, Guidance for the full year, which is for the remaining quarter, It's for the entire business. And we don't have like a specific View that we share externally on the U. S. Or Europe there.

Speaker 8

Okay. Okay. Follow-up on the 3rd party items. So another uptick here, just I think over 8% of revenue now. Can you talk about whether you expect are going to continue to rise as a mix of revenue or may this start to come down as you go forward and deal composition potential change.

Speaker 8

I'm just trying to think about sustainable level here as this has no doubt meaningfully over the last couple of years.

Speaker 3

Participants Yes. So as we've talked about this before, as we are involved in larger transformation deal, longer term transformation deals across the entire IT stack, infra, cyber, application development, data, I think many of these are bundled deals, which have have software, hardware elements in it. And in a way, that's also giving us the benefit of taking these larger deals off the table. And at the same time, we are able to manage our margins as well. So we are able to navigate both the impact of this.

Speaker 3

So we have no number in mind to say that this are aware we target at this optimal level, as long as we are able to get incremental market share and get margins in line, which is what the program of MAXIMUS is also about. I think we are comfortable with that. Okay.

Speaker 8

And just last one for you just on the chat and resourcing plans. Can you just give us a sense how you're thinking about resourcing plans near term? I know it was down again sequentially about 2%. Just curious if you kind of reached a stabilization point?

Speaker 3

Yes. So we still have a lot of headroom and we talked about it in the last two quarters that our utilizations are still quite low. We've operated at much higher utilizations 84%, 85% and then of course in the COVID years maybe 87, 88. So that's 1 and we are still below 84 as we speak. We also have on tap demand Because we don't have to now just go for colleges and wait for the annual cycle, now we have a source of supply from off campus as well.

Speaker 3

And with attrition slowing down, there is a lot of talent even from a lateral basis available across the country as well. So I don't think that's a big concern for us.

Speaker 8

Participants Good luck to you, Nandan. Thank you.

Speaker 3

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. Next question is from the line of it Veshmand from BMO. Please go ahead.

Speaker 9

Hi, thank you. I wanted to ask a couple of questions if I could. First on Pricing, you mentioned specific segment of pricing, but I wanted to ask about, a, pricing on renewals. Are you seeing pricing pressure that's different from past cycles at the time of renewals? And then also, You had good deal signings for large deals.

Speaker 9

I wanted to talk if you could address pricing for those large deals And how that might be impacting your margins? And then I have a follow-up please.

Speaker 3

Yes. So, I think, In fact, we've seen much better pricing stability over the last few years. And in fact, we are also very conscious with our entire value based selling program that we are not leaving any pennies on the table when we are going after deals, because in the hubris, participants are in the process of making sure that we are not leaving a lot of dollars on the table. So I think there's a lot of work happening there. But overall, from a competitive pricing really has been stable across and I think that's reflected of the cost pressure that people are parties are also conscious of their margins and where they are.

Speaker 3

So in that sense, there's no more concern. We of course have The one offs, etcetera, specific clients, specific segments, where they are in trouble and of course, they may want to rebate some of that. But overall, it's not been Something which is really concerning us in that sense today.

Speaker 9

Okay. And my follow-up relates to duration. This was asked a little bit differently early in the call, but as you're getting good signings of large deals, Is the duration of those large deals extending so that investors should

Speaker 4

be thinking about the book to

Speaker 9

bill being a bit longer?

Speaker 3

Participants So we don't give out the duration of the deal wins. So we have, of course, deals which come with longer term periods and some of our you could received some of the announcements we have made, but nothing specifically whether they are going up across, we don't comment on that.

Speaker 9

Okay. Well, then maybe I could sneak in one more. As you just look out over the next couple of quarters, if you could just help us participants I'm not asking for guidance, but just the puts and takes on margins that we should be thinking about. You've already said that utilization perhaps is a source of at least I heard it as potential margin upside as utilization goes up. I would think that wage pressures We should at least be considering as we're creating our margin profile over the next, call it, 4, 5 quarters.

Speaker 3

Yes. So I think one of the earlier questions was on this and probably I talked about in Project Maximus as well. I mean, there are other benefits which we don't factored into any of our models, really for instance, operating leverage, right. You can see the impact of SG and A benefits on operating margins participants when we are growing in the during 2021, 2022, 2023. So that's something which automatically flows into the P and L with growth, Right.

Speaker 3

And in a way, it gets reversed. The operating leverage works against you when revenues are down. So that's something From a pure margin perspective, which flexes. Secondly, I think similarly on the currency, we don't build in anything into our programs and that also comes in the future as well, but it's not part of MAXIMUS. Of course, there are things out there, you know how what expectations of dollar movements are.

Speaker 3

So these are some things more extraneous as well, Which can impact, but we are more confident of what we are able to control within the 20 tracks of MAXIMUS and we've talked about that.

Speaker 9

Okay. All right. Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Jamie Friedman from Susquehanna International Group. Please go ahead.

Speaker 7

Hi. Good evening. Nelanjan, in your prepared remarks, you expressed confidence in growth in the medium term. I was just hoping you could unpack that a little. When you say Medium term, is that just a comment about the 4th quarter or is that longer in duration?

Speaker 3

Yes, medium term is medium term. It's definitely more than the 4th quarter.

Speaker 7

Okay. Thank you. And then Also, Nilanjan and Salil, I've tried to reconcile when Salil observes the strength in the TCV in a record in 9 months. Participants But, Nalandjan, you used the word subdued in your prepared remarks. It seems like you're saying it's hot and cold at the same time.

Speaker 7

So, I know these are where many of these questions are going, but how can the weather be both?

Speaker 2

Participants Hi, this is Salil. Maybe the way that we are thinking about this, we can share with you. The large deals really give us good confidence of revenue over The next several period in terms of the wins, both for net new and renewals And the comment, which was more around subdued, We look at it from a perspective of where we see less activity on digital programs Unless activity on some of those type of projects, where that takes away a little bit From the revenue. So that's the sort of balance in our mind. One of them giving us that revenue Outlook in the other where clients are under constraints on their own spend, Reducing some of that.

Speaker 2

That's how we see the balance on that. Hopefully, that clarifies the comments.

Speaker 7

Thank you, Suhail. I'll drop back in the queue.

Operator

Thank you. Next question is from the line of Sameet Jain from CLSA. Please go ahead.

Speaker 10

Yes, hi. Thanks for the opportunity. Firstly, I wanted to ask around the one time loss what you had around Mekamish. Are you expecting it to reverse back in Q4 and included in your guidance? Or will it reverse sometime in FY 2025?

Speaker 3

No, this is one time. There is no reversal.

Speaker 10

Got it. And secondly, I wanted to check around your platform business. I mean, we have seen for the last 2 years, there's absolutely been no growth in that particular business, but although we keep seeing deliverance around your Pinnacle platform with various regional banks in the Middle East geography and other regional banks in North America as well. So can you share any plans to grow up that part of the piece where we have seen the other SaaS companies globally have actually seen a lot of traction post the Gen AI offerings and their solutions.

Speaker 3

Participants Yes. So I think we continue to do well. I think Pinnacle business continues to motor add. We have very nice deal wins across. And overall platforms is a more generic usage and I mean, we track it across various things, but Finnacle actually overall has been doing very well.

Speaker 10

So any reasons for the platform business to be flat over the last 2 years.

Speaker 3

So I think we can get back to you on that.

Speaker 10

Okay. That's all I had. Participants.

Speaker 3

Okay. I think Sandeep is just prompting me that we also use it for internal productivity as well. Okay. For services.

Speaker 4

Okay. Got it. Thank you.

Operator

The next question is from the line of Yogesh Agarwal from HSBC. Please go ahead.

Speaker 4

Yes, hi. Just one quick question. The employees number of employees are down 7% year on year, are in the range of 10% year on year. So I would have assumed that the pyramid would have kicked in, in a slower growth last few quarters. So any particular reason why the

Speaker 3

Sorry, I think one of the things is that the comp increase also has happened this quarter. And of course, in the initial part of the year, we had more lateral movements coming in, in the top end of the pyramid. So But I think in the recent if you see the latest quarter, you will see a reversal of that. I think the employee costs have come down, I think, in this quarter as well. So I think you will see that trend reversing.

Speaker 4

Great. Thanks, Nandan, and all the best for your future endeavors. Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Vibhor Singhal from Nomura Securities. Please go ahead.

Speaker 1

Participants. Yes, hi. Thanks for taking my question. So, just I know

Operator

Please use your handset. There's an echo in the line.

Speaker 1

Sure. Is it better now?

Operator

Yes, please. Go ahead.

Speaker 1

Yes. Thanks a lot for taking my questions. Participants So sorry, just a bit just a question on the lease flow number. I know we've already halved a bit on it. So but just wanted to take a bit of a feedback participants on we know this quarter was basically on the softer side both in terms of seasonality and probably furloughs being higher than the last year itself.

Speaker 1

But the overall demand environment that we are looking at, both let's say in terms of the cost takeout deals or the discretionary spends or basically participants that we're looking at, is there any change in the overall demand environment that we're looking at from let's say 3 months ago, I mean, let me met for the 2nd quarter results. And how do you see this playing out over the next couple of months as clients get into the business cycle and any specific verticals of OpEx that you might want to call?

Speaker 2

Participants So there, the thing that we've observed is As we look at our large client base, the way clients are behaving in terms of spend, we've not seen a change in the way they're looking at it. So we still see what we were discussing earlier on digital transformation programs there's also more consolidation that we're seeing and that was coming through in the past quarter as well. And then there's a lot of interest in almost every conversation we have where generative AI is part of the mix. So in that sense, I don't have a feel that this is there's a change that we're seeing. Now, This is also the start of the financial the calendar year.

Speaker 2

We will get a sense fairly quickly how people our clients are looking at their spend. And as we come to the end of our financial year and as we plan for next year that will give us, let's say, more view into that spending pattern.

Speaker 1

Participants Got it. Got it. And in terms of the deal flow, I mean, the deal wins that we had in the first half of the year were very dog solid deal wins. Any color on, let's say, some of those deals getting into execution mode driven by the conversation with your clients? How is the I mean, so are we seeing incremental some basically, let's say, intent from the clients on are starting those deals, which were maybe a bit delayed on that side, but anything any color on that that we have seen incrementally over the last 3 months?

Speaker 2

Participants So there we've seen essentially in this last 3 months cycle, the deal are starting or ramping up being as we had anticipated. So nothing has changed in this 3 month cycle. There are places in some of the large deals where there's need for incremental work, which is also are starting to be visible, which will hopefully flow through. So there has been no delay that we've seen. In fact, We've seen more of those on track in the last 3 months.

Speaker 1

Got it. Got it. Thanks for taking my questions and wish you all the best.

Operator

Thank you.

Speaker 2

Thank you.

Operator

The next question is from the line of Karl Rateria from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.

Speaker 11

Hi, thanks for taking my questions. The first question is with respect to the bigger deal signed in 2Q, the transition period was expected to be a little longer and some of them were supposed to come into revenues in the 4th quarter itself. So is the expectation remaining similar on that or has anything changed with respect to the transition period and flow through of the revenue?

Speaker 2

There as we had shared previously, it was towards the end of the year and that's Where we are, so we don't see that changing.

Speaker 11

Got it. Second question is with respect to the underlying sort of leakage in the business on small deals discretionary spend that has been continuing now for some time. How do you characterize your 3Q versus, let's say, 1Q and 2Q? Has the leakage remained largely similar? Or has that kind of come down compared to the pace that it was kind of leaking in the 1st 2 quarters.

Speaker 2

So that let me sort of try to give color in the way we look at it. In the last quarter, so in the last 3 months, we have not seen those things

Speaker 11

And is that a similar thing built in your outlook for the Q4 as well when you tightened your guided band?

Speaker 2

At this stage, that's what we've put into the Q4 outlook. Yes.

Speaker 11

Got it. Last question is on the margins. Given that you will have some bit of more headwind in Q4 because there will be full 3 month impact of the wages that you have provided for in this quarter, your margins probably will have some more headwinds 4th quarter also, so no major massive operating leverage per se. It's just that you're exiting the year with margins closer to the lower end of the guide. Is that the bottom for the margins?

Speaker 11

And given the Project MAXIMUS is underway, from here on, the margin should only will be going in the upward direction. Is that the way to look for it? I'm not specifically looking for fiscal 2025, but just trying to understand is that the bottom of the line? Thank you.

Speaker 3

Yes. So in Q4, I mean, it will work out of Q3 as well and there are puts and takes in Q3. And like we've said, Project Maximus continues to deliver very strongly. And in our overall commentary, we've talked about the optimism in the medium term for our margins are coming out of MAXIMUS.

Speaker 11

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. Next question is from the line of Sandeep Shah from Equiris Securities. Please go ahead.

Speaker 4

Yes, thanks for the opportunity. Most of the questions have been answered. Just wanted to understand the could have been there because of the cost will actually no longer be there. It would be a tailwind in the 4th quarter.

Speaker 3

Yes, I think firstly, we won't can't split it, but both these are one time impacts, Right, the loss of revenue and the cost impact. So this was like the puts and takes. So this is going to In Q4, as we see it now, this is not going to be there.

Speaker 4

Okay. And so even the revenue will come back in the Q4, right? Participants Yes.

Speaker 3

So I think in the statement you have seen that the systems are back substantially by the end of December, Right, the system is up and running.

Speaker 6

So I

Speaker 3

think that part goes away.

Speaker 4

Okay. And Nilanjan, for 2 months of wage hike, 60 to 70 bps wage impact looks slightly lower. So is it the almost 100% of the eligible employees have been covered? And is it fair to assume the wage impact would be much lower in the 4th quarter because it

Speaker 3

It's going to be a 1 month Absolutely. And every time we do a wage hike, we look at, of course, the competitive scenario, we look at the market, attrition, employees, tenure, what are the pay point grids. So it's a very complex exercise. And Based on this, we think what we have rolled out and it's of course you can see the attrition figures are also good.

Speaker 4

Okay. And last question, Saleel, I think one of the participants you said the furloughs in the December quarter may continue in the March quarter. Is it I have heard correctly or I have been mistaken?

Speaker 2

Participants So there what we saw is my point was on more Q3, We had the furloughs and that is a seasonal impact. In Q4, we typically see a little bit of that are always in our business in Australia and that's really the reference I was making.

Speaker 4

Okay, okay. Thanks and all the best. And all the best, Nilanjan. Participants

Speaker 3

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Kavajeet Saluja from Kotak. Please go ahead.

Speaker 3

Hi. My question is for Nilanjan. Nilanjan, the margins for this quarter, Is it based on your normal variable compensation provision? Or is that something which has taken a hit in this quarter? Participants Yes.

Speaker 3

So, Kamal, we don't talk about the variable pay of costs. I think in the next few, There'll be enough news in the papers about that, but we don't give any commentary on variable pay. Yes. I mean, I think it will make its way to the media after a month, so might as well talk Thanks, Kala.

Operator

Thank you. Next question is from the line of Manik Taneja from Axis Capital. Please go ahead.

Speaker 1

Thank you for

Speaker 4

the opportunity. Just wanted to understand over the course of last 9 to 12 months, Industry has been complaining about the leakage on the existing projects as well as non Extension of discretionary projects. Are you seeing any change on that front? That's question number 1. The second question was with regards to participants The expansion in terms of captive centers and we continue to see news flow on that front.

Speaker 4

Any comments from you on that front?

Speaker 2

Thanks. I think on the first part, participants in the last quarter, so in this Q3, we've not had essentially a similar type of a trajectory. On the captive centers participants There typically we see that anytime there's new sort of technology shifts, whether there was Digital or cloud or generative AI, there's definitely more interest in some clients building out Equally as technologies age, we see some clients are looking to Exit and especially to be more optimized. And we've seen that in several of our large deals. If you look back over the last several quarters, we've had deals where in addition to the transformation, we've taken on the task of optimizing pre existing captives and so on.

Speaker 2

So we don't see a change. It's just Maybe it's that new technology moment where we see the activity, but we also see Converse activity of things which were, let's say, set up 5, 7, 10 years ago, which are going through that change or decline in that situation.

Speaker 4

Sure. And one last question from my end. Participants We've been seeing our headcount reduced for the last several quarters. Any sense on how we should be thinking about The optimization on this front given the kind of deal wins that we've had in the last three quarters?

Speaker 3

Yes. So I think I've mentioned that a couple of times, utilization is something where we have headroom. So The decline in headcount really doesn't concern us too much. And both from availability of talent to ramp up, We have now have a very strong off campus program. This is something over the last 3 or 4 years we've perfected post COVID And that's really on tap without having to give out requests to colleges 1 year in advance.

Speaker 3

And And of course, from a lateral perspective, like I mentioned, with the market being soft, there is, of course, talent available even laterally. So in that sense, we are very, very comfortable with any are not comfortable with any volume requirements and ability to fulfill.

Speaker 4

Sure. Thank you and all the

Operator

best for the future.

Speaker 9

Thank you.

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question for today. I now hand the conference over to the management for their closing remarks. Thank you and over to you.

Speaker 2

Thank you. Just first everyone on the call, thanks very much for joining us and for your questions. I want to just summarize with a few points. First, we're very excited with the large deals at $3,200,000,000 70 percent net new. Participants are very happy with the strong margin and also for our have extremely strong margin improvement program that's in play.

Speaker 2

Our generative AI work is really pervasive. It's across all of our client discussions in our service lines and we believe we're building extremely deep capability within our Topaz set of capabilities. We see continued strong focus on cost takeout, consolidation and we have extreme strength in that. Participants we feel good that that will continue. If that continues, we have a good play into that.

Speaker 2

And then finally, we feel are good overall about the resilience of our business given the quarter and the seasonality that we had and the overall economic environment, we feel really good about the resilience of our business and the future. So thank you everyone again and look forward to catching up have the next quarter call.

Operator

Thank you very much members of the management. Ladies and gentlemen, on behalf of Infosys,

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Earnings Conference Call
Infosys Q3 23/24
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