Cadence Design Systems Q3 2024 Earnings Call Transcript

Quartr
Provided by Quartr
October 28, 2024

There are 16 speakers on the call.

Operator

Good afternoon. My name is Brianna, and I will be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to the Cadence Third Quarter 2024 Earnings Conference Call. All lines have been placed on mute to prevent any background noise. After the speakers' remarks, there will be a question and answer session.

Operator

Thank you. I will now turn the call over to Richard Gu, Vice President of Investor Relations for Cadence. Please go ahead, sir.

Speaker 1

Thank you, operator. I would like to welcome everyone to our Q3 of 2024 earnings conference call. I'm joined today by Anur Devgan, President and Chief Executive Officer and John Wall, Senior Vice President and Chief Financial Officer. The webcast of this call and a copy of today's prepared remarks will be available on our website, cadence.com. Today's discussion will contain forward looking statements, including our outlook on future business and operating results.

Speaker 1

Due to risks and uncertainties, actual results may differ materially from those projected or implied in today's discussion. For information on factors that could cause actual results to differ, please refer to our SEC filings, including our most recent Forms 10 ks and 10 Q, CFO commentary and today's earnings release. All forward looking statements during this call are based on estimates and information available to us as of today, and we disclaim any obligation to update them. In addition, all financial measures discussed on this call are non GAAP, unless otherwise specified. The non GAAP measures should not be considered in isolation from or as a substitute for GAAP results.

Speaker 1

Reconciliations of GAAP to non GAAP measures are included in today's earnings release. For the Q and A session today, we would ask that you observe a limit of one question and one follow-up. Now, I'll turn the call over to Anurud.

Speaker 2

Thank you, Richard. Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us today. Cadence delivered exceptional results for the Q3 of 2024 with broad based strength across our product portfolio. We are on track for a strong second half, and we are pleased to raise our full year EPS outlook. John will provide more details on our financials in a moment.

Speaker 2

Generational trends such as hyperscale computing, autonomous driving and 5 gs, all accelerated by the AI super cycle, continue to fuel strong design activity across multiple verticals, especially in data center and automotive. Our cutting edge chip to system platforms empower customers to drive unprecedented innovation as the race to develop next gen AI and agentic AI products, while navigating escalating design complexities. We continue steadily executing to our intelligent system design strategy that triples our TAM opportunity, while significantly expanding our portfolio across core EDA, IP and system design and analysis. I'm excited about AI's incredible promise and how rapidly it is becoming an integral part of the design workflow, with customers steadily increasing their investments in AI driven automation. Our Cadence dotai portfolio powered by Gen AI agents, AI driven optimization and big data analytics Jedi platform saw sales nearly triple over the last year as it continued delivering unparalleled quality of results and productivity benefits.

Speaker 2

We continue partnering with NVIDIA to accelerate AI innovation and are using their latest NEMO and NIM microservices to build customized Gen AI application, delivering enhanced optimization and productivity. In Q3, we deepened our partnership with Arm through a broad expansion of our IP, hardware and AI driven design enablement solutions to help deliver Arm's next generation AI technologies and advanced Arm compute subsystems across multiple markets. We expanded our long standing partnership with TSMC, with AI optimized design flows certified for TSMC's N3 and N2P technologies. We are also collaborating on innovative solutions for next generation technologies, like TSMC A16 and 3 d blocks that are paving the way for the AI factories of tomorrow. Demand for our industry leading integrity 3 d IC solution that enables system level PPA optimization continues to grow, with accelerating adoption by hyperscalers, OSATs and foundries.

Speaker 2

We introduced the industry's 1st auto router for both die to die and die to substrate connectivity. And that was showcased at TSMC's 3 d Fabric Alliance workshop. High speed, multilayer PCB designs require increasing levels of miniaturization, advanced simulation and AI driven automation. Allegro X, with its tight integration with our analysis technology and expanded collaboration platform, is ramping strongly and drove over 40% of our PCB sales this year. The transition to OrCAD X, our new mainstream PCB solution accelerated in Q3, with a third of our OrCAD customers converting to this new cloud enabled solution.

Speaker 2

Cadence On Cloud is a key go to market platform to reach the long tail of smaller system customers and is seeing strong traction with over 400 customers, tens of thousands of online users and orders doubling over the past year. We recently launched the Cadence On Cloud Marketplace and announced Cadence online support through On Cloud, which uses Gen AI technology to provide insightful, contextual and accurate answers to customer queries. As the digital transformation in aerospace and defense accelerates, we saw continued strength in this vertical as the U. S. Air Force and Army expanded their commitment to cadences solutions spanning from chips to boards to systems.

Speaker 2

Our hardware accurate digital twins have been successfully used by Northrop Grumman in taping out several ASICs, helping accelerate schedule by over 2 years. In Q3, we substantially grew our footprint at several marquee hyperscalers through a broad proliferation of our best in class hardware systems, IP and software portfolio. Our system design and analysis business continued to outpace the market, delivering impressive results with over 40% year over year revenue growth in Q3. We are pleased with the strong growth of our multi physics portfolio that couples our expertise in physics based modeling with AI driven optimization to deliver superior results to customers. Claroty and Celsius both grew strongly with competitive wins, while our newly acquired beta CAE products that round out our system analysis portfolio outperformed our expectations as we signed large deals with major EV companies.

Speaker 2

Our AI driven optimality solution was adopted by several leading customers, and Voltus Insight AI were used by a top hyperscaler to successfully achieve an 80% IR drop reduction in their designs. Our IT business continued its strong momentum in Q3, delivering over 50% year over year revenue growth, as we executed to our profitable and scalable growth strategy. Increasing complexity of interconnect protocols along with the growing outsourcing trend and new foundry opportunities are providing strong tailwinds to our IP business. AI, HPC and chiplet use cases were the primary drivers for the adoption of our differentiated HBM, PCIe, UCIE, DDR and high speed SerDes solutions in design ranging from 7 nanometer down to the most advanced gate all around nodes. Our AI assisted Tensilica audio DSP scored multiple design wins with marquee global customers across HPC, mobile and automotive use cases.

Speaker 2

Our core EDA business comprised of our custom, digital and functional verification businesses delivered 9% year over year revenue growth in Q3. Our new groundbreaking hardware systems offering industry's leading performance, capacity and scalability experienced strong demand, especially at AI, hyperscale and automotive companies. Verisium, our AI driven verification platform, continued seeing rapid customer adoption, with several leading customers successfully using Verisium Sim AI for highly efficient coverage maximization. Proliferation of our digital full flow at the most advanced nodes accelerated with over 30 new full flow logos added over the past year. With nearly 450 tape outs, customers are increasingly deploying Cadence Cerebras AI solution, as it continues to deliver unparalleled PPA and productivity benefits on a broad spectrum of designs.

Speaker 2

Our AI driven Virtuoso Studio leverages the capabilities of our flagship Virtuoso platform, while seamlessly integrating with other cadence cutting edge technologies to drive significant productivity benefits for analog, RF and mixed signal designers. With this Gen AI driven automated design migration and new layout placement and routing technologies, customers are rapidly adopting Virtusa Studio and it won 30 new logos in Q3. In summary, I'm pleased with our Q3 results and the continuing momentum of our business. The AI driven automation era offers massive opportunities and the co optimization of our comprehensive EDA, SDA and IP portfolio with accelerated compute and AI orchestration uniquely positions us to provide disruptive solutions to multiple verticals. Now I will turn it over to John to provide more details on the Q3 results and our updated 2024 outlook.

Speaker 3

Thanks, Anurud, and good afternoon, everyone. I'm pleased to report that Cadence delivered strong Q3 results with total revenue of over $1,200,000,000 We achieved 19% year over year growth. Our Q3 recurring revenue growth returned to low teens on a year over year basis. Our intelligent system design strategy is paying off with our system design and analysis business delivering strong growth and we continue to see robust demand for our emulation and prototyping systems. Here are some of the financial highlights from the Q3 starting with the P and L.

Speaker 3

Total revenue was $1,215,000,000 GAAP operating margin was 28.8 percent and non GAAP operating margin was 44.8 percent and GAAP EPS was $0.87 with non GAAP EPS of $1.64 Next turning to the balance sheet and cash flow, we had a $2,500,000,000 senior notes offering in Q3 that was well received by the market. We have used the majority of the net proceeds to retire maturing notes and prepaid term loans as well as for other general corporate purposes. Cash balance at quarter end was $2,786,000,000 while the principal value of debt outstanding was $2,850,000,000 Operating cash flow was $410,000,000 DSOs were 44 days and we used $150,000,000 to repurchase Cadence shares. Before I provide our updated outlook, I'd like to highlight that it contains the usual assumption that export control regulations that exist today remain substantially similar for the remainder of the year. Our updated outlook for 2024 is revenue in the range of 4.61 dollars to $4,650,000,000 GAAP operating margin in the range of 29% to 30% non GAAP operating margin in the range of 42% to 43% GAAP EPS in the range of $3.70 to 3 point 76 dollars non GAAP EPS in the range of $5.87 to $5.93 operating cash flow in the range of $1,000,000,000 to $1,200,000,000 and we expect to use approximately 50 percent of our annual free cash flow to repurchase Cadence shares.

Speaker 3

With that in mind, for Q4, we expect revenue in the range of $1,325,000,000 to $1,365,000,000 GAAP operating margin in the range of 33.2% to 34.2 percent non GAAP operating margin in the range of 45.2% to 46.2% GAAP EPS in the range of $1.09 to 1 $0.15 and non GAAP EPS in the range of $1.78 to 1 $0.84 And as usual, we published a CFO commentary document on our Investor Relations website, which includes our outlook for additional items as well as further analysis and GAAP to non GAAP reconciliations. In conclusion, I'm pleased with our Q3 results. Our Q4 bookings pipeline looks exceptionally strong and we are well positioned to deliver a strong 2024. As always, I'd like to close by thanking our customers, partners and our employees for their continued support. And with that operator, we will now take questions.

Operator

Your first question comes from Joe Vruwink with Baird.

Speaker 4

Great. Hi, everyone. I appreciate the nature of your relationships with customers means you typically know well in advance what product roadmaps might be. You're typically not learning new information off of public calls. But just given the number of headlines of late around advanced foundry efforts or maybe demand from China, I wanted to ask, have you learned anything over the past 3 months or so that you would point out as maybe being something worth considering either good or bad as investors think about the 2025 opportunity for Cadence?

Speaker 2

Yes. Hi, Joe. This is Anirudh. That's a good question. Well, I would say that, I mean, as you know already that the importance of semiconductor to the overall global economy is increasing and is more well recognized now.

Speaker 2

And I did visit several countries over the last quarter and there is more and more kind of commitment to build that out. And you're seeing that in different countries and also like we highlighted even earlier in the year, of course, TSMC is leading foundry, but our own relationship with Samsung and Intel in this area has improved. And global also we have worked for several years. So I would like to say that in general we do see this continued investment in newer foundries whether it's Intel, Samsung and even like Rapidas in Japan and other countries. So and we continue to partner closely with the leading players like TSMC and ARM as we highlighted in this report, but it's good to see more investments we've made in other areas.

Speaker 4

Okay. Thanks for that. And then, John, you don't normally give backlog guidance, but you did comment on bookings pipeline in 4Q and that stands out. Are you maybe able to go into a bit more color on what you might expect or what you would be looking for as kind of the forerunner to your 2025 performance?

Speaker 3

Yes. I mean, thanks for picking up on that, Joe. I mean, obviously, we're not giving any outlook on 2025 yet. But it's we have a very, very strong pipeline right now for Q4. I think it's the biggest I've ever seen for Q4 pipeline.

Speaker 3

It reminds me a little bit, it's kind of similar to how we finished 2021. If you recall in 2021, we had a really strong pickup in bookings in Q4 2021. About 40% of our annual bookings came in Q4 of 2021. And this year, the second half seems to be setting up the same way. But it's exceptionally strong pipeline and we're seeing strong design activity everywhere.

Speaker 4

Great. Thank you very much.

Operator

Your next question comes from Jason Celino with KeyBanc Capital Markets.

Speaker 5

Hey, thanks for taking my questions. Maybe just following up on Joe's backlog question. So I understand that the pipeline looks quite large. Is it fair to say that the composition of that pipeline is mostly being hardware driven? I guess curious what you're seeing from a new order pipeline perspective on kind of the Z3, X3?

Speaker 3

Hi, Jason. Thanks for the opportunity to clarify that. I mean, it's broad based right across the board, across all of our businesses. All the businesses are performing really, really well. I mean, when I look at our forecast for the remainder of the year, on a 3 year CAGR basis, I mean, all business groups are on track for strong growth from low double digit growth on the core EDA software side right through to kind of mid teen growth right up to almost 30% growth for

Speaker 6

like IP, functional verification, which hardware is part of and system

Speaker 3

design and analysis. Okay. And then, design and analysis. Okay, perfect. And then

Speaker 6

just one really quick one on China. I think last quarter, I think you

Speaker 5

were trying to derisk some of your assumptions. Obviously, this quarter, there were some incremental worries that the region might be taking another leg down. But obviously, Cadence and EDA see very different purchasing habits and demand drivers from semi cap and some of the smaller point solution providers. But do you still expect to see 13% of your revenues come from China this year? I guess what else can you tell us about the overall demand environment there?

Speaker 3

Yes, great question. Again, Jason, I mean, you're reading my mind. I mean, myself and my team were looking through China. We went back we're data driven. We went back 25 years to have a look at our China revenue.

Speaker 3

And because I mean, we're expecting China revenue to be lower this year than last year. That's only happened 3 times in the last 25 years. First time was 2,008. Obviously, there were macro things that had gone on back in 2,008, and it took until 2011 for us to reach a new high in China revenue. But it recovered immediately in 2,009.

Speaker 3

It dipped in 2021, recovered immediately to a new high in 2022, And it looks like it's dipping in 2024. But I'm very, very pleased that Q2 was stronger than Q1 on a dollar basis, Q3 was stronger than Q2 and China seems to be recovering well with strong design activity.

Speaker 5

Okay. Thank you very much.

Operator

Our next question comes from Gianmarco Conte with Deutsche Bank.

Speaker 7

Yes. Hi. Thank you very much for taking the questions and congrats again for a great quarter. Maybe perhaps if you could touch a little bit on the cadence.ed.aiSuite, if you're seeing incremental appetite there and is it going to be material for 2025 growth? If you could give us any data points or qualitative anecdotes that will be amazing.

Speaker 7

Thank you.

Speaker 2

Yes, absolutely. I mean, we are pretty pleased with how our Cadence dotai portfolio is doing. And like mentioned earlier, I mean, right now, I think it is used by all our top customers. So now some of them are the model proliferation is different at each customer. But right now, we are engaged in all of our top customers with our AI solutions.

Speaker 2

And as you may know, we have 5 major AI platforms, all the analog, digital, verification, PCB and package and system analysis. So it's a pretty rich portfolio. And the customers are routinely seeing anywhere from 5% to 20% improvement in PPA, which is significant. I think the value of AI is not just productivity, which is huge. I mean, we have a history of productivity improvements in EDA, but the value of AI is when it can give a better result.

Speaker 2

So that's where I think the real value and monetization can happen if the result is better. And we also design our own chips as well. As you know, palladium, we design our own chip, one of the most complicated chips that is made by TSMC. And we design our own IP, right, in our IP group. So we are also applying our own solutions internally as well.

Speaker 2

So, to give you these are like true comparisons of AI versus non AI solution. So, even in the latest Palladium Z3 chip, we saw like 15% improvement in power using Cadence Cerebras. And in the latest AI IP we design, we saw anywhere from 13% to 20% improvement in our IP group using our own Cadence dot ai solutions, which is very consistent with what we see with top customers. So overall, we are pleased with the benefit we are getting, especially with the improvement in PPA. And productivity improvements can be anywhere between 5x to 10x, but the PPA benefits are truly remarkable and almost equivalent to one kind of node, one process node migration typically get 15% to 20% PPA improvement and we can get that with AI.

Speaker 2

And then the last thing I would like to highlight with AI is our Cadence on cloud offering. So we do have a Cadence customer support portal and we are applying GenAI in there to give better kind of response to our customers. And this is another big trend of applying AI to give better customer support. So overall, applying cadence AI, of course, working with all our top customers across all 5 major platforms, applying AI internally to improve our own designs, whether it's in hardware group or IP, and then applying AI for customer support can make us much more efficient.

Speaker 5

Amazing. If I could just ask

Speaker 7

a quick follow-up. Is it fair to say that in Q4, we should see the air pocket of Hardwick kind of closing out? And if you could share sort of any commentary around 2025 visibility, particularly from your over ordering of the FPGAs and the raw materials. I'm just kind of curious how does that translate into backlog? I know you think you don't specifically guide in backlog, but obviously backlog was a little bit down sequentially.

Speaker 7

And so any commentary there that will be amazing. Thank you.

Speaker 3

Yes, Gian and Marco. I certainly wouldn't categorize our ordering of FPGAs as over ordering. We're ordering to fit the demand that we see. We're seeing very robust demand. The pipeline is super strong.

Speaker 3

But like I said, I haven't seen it as strong as this in any previous Q4 that I've been here. So we're set up for tremendous Q4. At this time of the year, year, it's always difficult to give any indication as to what next year looks like. And particularly in years like this, when you expect such a strong bookings quarter in Q4, we kind of have to get that landed and look at the quality of that before we give any indication as to what next year looks like. But I'm very, very pleased with the hardware demand, with the performance of the business and they're ramping up production all the time to meet the demand.

Speaker 7

Okay. Thank you very much.

Operator

Our next question comes from Lee Simpson with Morgan Stanley.

Speaker 8

Great. Good evening, everyone. So couple of quick ones from me actually. Just looking at the Millennium platform, following on from the last question there, could you maybe characterize what is the interest beyond NVIDIA? When, who and how big do we think the demand will be for that platform?

Speaker 8

And maybe as a follow on question, I'm just interested on the timing of the impact from new collaboration with ARM on CSS. Does that have any specific vertical to it? Is that autos or is it maybe the aerospace stuff that you were talking about there? Thanks.

Speaker 2

Yes. Good question, Lee. So, first, in terms of Arm, I mean, we have a pretty broad partnership with Arm over the years, I mean, going back like 10 years. And especially in their IP development, CPUs and GPUs. And this latest collaboration, which we highlighted, is also expanding to compute subsystems and total design, which is ARM doing more, as you know, more chiplets and more droplets.

Speaker 2

And this is broad based, but I think they are this is more a question for ARM, but they are seeing a lot of strength in multiple markets, including HPC and automotive. But this is expansion of as ARM kind of morphs their strategy, our relationship with ARM gets even stronger, not just in IP development, but also for total compute. And in terms of your other questions on Millennium, in general, I'm optimistic like I mentioned before that with these new systems, we can accelerate lot of our software on combination of CPUs and GPUs, okay? And Millennium is a perfect example. And the reason for that is, I mean, of course, we can accelerate EDA.

Speaker 2

We got like fabulous results in Spectre. We are the leading provider of circuit simulation, which Specture is the leading platform. And with these latest systems, we are able to accelerate circuit simulation by 5x to 10x by these CPU, GPU acceleration platforms. But also on system design and analysis, which is Millennium is a perfect example for that. And the reason for that is that system design and analysis by nature, the algorithms involved does lot of matrix multiply, Like CFD is essentially a matrix multiply operation.

Speaker 2

And the other thing that is largely of matrix multiply is, of course, AI. So and these systems are well tuned for AI or matrix multiply operations. So they are very naturally tuned for SDNA kind of applications. So I'm pretty optimistic that because we're getting tremendous results and we are seeing that CFD and especially with the aerospace and automotive companies, okay, because this is typically they have been limited by how much simulation they can provide. And I think we highlighted, like for example, Honda is a great kind of early development partner for Millennium.

Speaker 2

And in general, as these platforms get more sophisticated, the CPU, GPU platforms, I think we can apply this acceleration to a broader portfolio and you'll see that going forward.

Speaker 8

That's great. Thanks so much.

Operator

Our next question comes from Charles Hsieh with Needham.

Speaker 9

Good afternoon, Anil and John. I want to ask another question about the Intel and Samsung, but from another perspective, I mean, despite all the headlines, which were not so positive, we know that those two customers will wear your market share historically as being a little bit underrepresented, but largely because they are still using the internal EDA tools. So I mean given all the challenges those two customers seems to be facing, although it doesn't sound like you are seeing any immediate changes, Is it possible that it can be a net positive for you guys? And if there is more dependence of those 2 customers on the commercial EDA tools, meaning more of the EDA development work being outsourced to the merchant EDA companies like Cadence. I want to get some thoughts

Speaker 10

on that

Speaker 9

and what could be, let's say, an inflection point for that to happen if it happens? Thanks.

Speaker 2

Yes. Hi, Charles. That's a great observation. I mean, as you know, we are very strong in the historically strong over the last 5, 10 years in the TSMC ecosystem with partnership with TSMC and ARM and historically not as strong with Samsung and Intel, though I think that is beginning to change, especially last year and this year. And to me, there's always every company goes through ups and downs, as you know.

Speaker 2

And whenever I mean, both Intel and Samsung are great companies. And when they're going through more challenges, it typically is more opportunities for us. We always lead with products. We believe we have the best solution. So and we are seeing that.

Speaker 2

We saw with Intel, we mentioned our IP partnership, also the strength of our new hardware platforms across we are working with both these companies on our new systems on and then AI enabled software. So typically these things will take time. So but in general whenever there is a competitive situation with some of these big customers, typically, we have done well historically in those situations.

Speaker 9

Got it. Thanks. Maybe the other question I want to ask is hopefully you can clarify because it has been the news that Cadence may be acquiring Altair or maybe looking to acquire Altair Engineering Systems. Mind if you provide some comments here?

Speaker 2

Charles, yes, I mean, as you know, we don't comment on specific rumors. But, I mean, as we have said before, I mean, we are very pleased with our strategy. We are very pleased that most of our growth is organic and sometimes we do some small tuck in M and A and that strategy has not changed, okay. So that's our plan going forward and we are pretty happy with how we are positioned.

Speaker 11

Thanks so much, Anurag.

Operator

Our next question comes from Jay Vleeschhouwer with Griffin Securities.

Speaker 6

Thank you. Good evening. Anurag, you may recall that on the conference call a quarter ago, you spoke about various AIML use cases that you were beginning to see. And then separately, we also talked about how you might over time change your product packaging for different use cases or end markets. And maybe we can bring those two things together.

Speaker 6

And the question is, do you see a likelihood of for AI and ML applications more and more vertical domain specific packaging? I know you've got the branded apps right now. You're obviously selling into different verticals. But would you foresee taking any of those technologies and making them specifically packaged to specific end markets? And also before I get to my follow-up, could you also talk a little bit about your AI ML development roadmap?

Speaker 6

You've had customers speak at Cadence Live about what they're looking for from you in that respect. And maybe you could talk about improvements you're going to be making in things like capacity, memory footprint, scenario proliferation, so on and so forth? Then I'll ask my follow-up.

Speaker 2

Yes. Hi, Jay. That's all great observations. I mean, we have, of course, one of the highest investments in R and D, and we are very pleased with our kind of roadmap for AI and AI products. But we will enroll that over time, right?

Speaker 2

As you know, it's kind of I don't want to preannounce anything here. But overall, I think we are investing heavily. And as AI itself gets more powerful, the 3 layer cake that I always talk about, the AI orchestration at the top, the middle layer of principal simulation and optimization and the bottom layer like I mentioned earlier with CPU, GPU and custom silicon. So we are investing in all these three areas. And it may make sense for some verticalization like we did for Millennium, right?

Speaker 2

That is a vertical targeted

Speaker 6

at

Speaker 2

a particular vertical with aerospace and automotive. But overall, we are pretty pleased with that. And like we I also believe that I mean AI itself is a very big topic, but there are 2 parts of it. The initial phase is horizontal, and we are also we have a lot of horizontal technologies. But over time, I think the AI monetization will have to be more and more vertical.

Speaker 2

And I've talked about this publicly, the 3 phases of AI. So we are right now in what I would call infrastructure AI, starting with data centers and then going into edge devices like laptops and phones. And even in data centers, we have more vertical solutions now with thermal management and things like that. But that's horizon 1, which is infrastructure AI. Horizon 2 in my mind is physical AI, things like self driving, drones, robots.

Speaker 2

And even though the auto market is weak right now, but in terms of design, it's not weak, okay? As you see, a lot of the reporting on semiconductor autos is weak. But in terms of design activity, there's a lot of design activity for what is there to come. And this is what I saw like few years ago in data center is we are seeing in automotive. And lot of the chips that are required for automotives are very similar to what are required for drones and robots, okay?

Speaker 2

So to me, that's like the 2nd phase of AI, which is physical AI. And then the 3rd phase of AI, which is Horizon 3, which is further out from the physical AI, is what I would call sciences AI. And the biggest application will be life sciences, okay? And that's why the investment in OpenAI 2 years ago. So that's how we look at it, infrastructure AI followed by physical AI, followed by sciences AI.

Speaker 2

And we will have, of course, horizontal solutions because our business is fundamentally horizontal for multiple end markets. But as these markets evolve, we will also have some vertical solutions that are tuned to especially these megatrends of infrastructure, physical AI and sciences AI. But exciting times and

Speaker 7

Okay. Thanks.

Speaker 2

Go ahead.

Speaker 6

Thank you. Sorry about that. So you noted the strength in SG and A generally, including some upside for the 1st full quarter with beta CAE. But from a larger perspective, the fact is since you did your first acquisitions for the ISD strategy, you've done 7 or 8 acquisitions over $2,100,000,000 of cumulative value, but you're still very much the challenger in that market with a fraction of market share relative to the market leaders. So maybe you could talk about how you're thinking about more tightly coupling across the various applications you have in CFD and SD and A and talk about how you're thinking about ramping up in go to market especially, which is also something that I think you need to do to supplement what you've done on the coat acquisition side?

Speaker 2

Yes, Jay. That's a great observation. So first of all, especially like we mentioned earlier with the beta acquisition, and which is doing pretty well, we feel that our portfolio is fairly complete, okay? So whether it is electromagnetics or thermal and now with CFD and then structural. So and the key thing that I watch and you can see in our results is the growth rate, okay, not just how complete the portfolio is, but how well it's performing in the market.

Speaker 2

And we are pretty pleased to see that the growth rate is good and I believe much better than the overall market. And part of it is now that one part is, of course, the products have to be good. And I believe our products are best in class, whether it's clarity for is routinely like 5 to 10 times faster. Celsius, the only unique solution that can do thermal, both finite element and CFD for 3 d IC in general applications with beta, with Millennium, but also go to market. So I think we have highlighted before and especially this quarter really went into full effect is we want to go to market in 3 big ways.

Speaker 2

So one way is direct, right, which is cadence trend, working with the top customers. Our history, especially in EDA is, of course, working directly with the world's best companies. So we are doing that in SDA as well, and that's where we were focused last few years was and we still are with the top companies. But we need to augment that with 2 other parts of the strategy, which the other system design companies do anyway. So the second part apart from direct channel is what we would call indirect channel, through channel partners.

Speaker 2

And then the 3rd part of go to market is e commerce and cloud offerings, okay. So I think at this point, especially in Q3, I feel that we are hitting our stride in this go to market. And for example, apart from the top customers where we go direct, with a channel partner or indirect channel, we have now more than 100 partners, okay, which is a significant increase from earlier. And also on cloud itself, which is the e commerce direct channel, we have tens of thousands of users. And what we are also doing is we are all our channel partners are also going to market through on cloud.

Speaker 2

So whether the customer directly buys through e commerce or buys in a traditional way, all the data is captured in this online platform, so which is great for cross selling, it's great for lead generation. So I really feel that we'll see how it progresses in the future. But especially this year, we are go to market has improved. Now that our products are in good shape, we need to focus on go to market, especially indirect channel and direct customer sales.

Speaker 3

And if I could add to that as well, Jay, it's way more than just beta. I mean beta is fantastic in that we're getting more pull through revenue, especially in automotive as a result of beta rounding out our multi physics platform. But we're also getting strong momentum in A and D. Do you want to talk more about the A and D?

Speaker 2

Yes, absolutely. I mean A and D like we highlighted this time, I mean not just the traditional see what is exciting about A and D to me is not just the traditional dibs like Northrop Grumman, which we have a long history of working with, both on the silicon side and the system side. But also we are now directly working with like we highlighted the U. S. Air Force and U.

Speaker 2

S. Army. So and in terms of SD and A, there's 3 big markets. There's the traditional markets of high-tech or electronics. Anyway, that's where traditionally strong in.

Speaker 2

And the 2 other markets are aerospace and automotive. So apart from beta helping us in automotive, I think aerospace, our own history with Northrop and other and the strength of our portfolio, so we feel that we are well positioned in these 3 big markets.

Speaker 6

Great. Thanks very much.

Operator

Our next question comes from Vivek Arya with Bank of America Securities.

Speaker 12

Thanks for taking my question. So Anirudh, despite all the secular drivers, the stock has underperformed this year because of revenue lumpiness and we have seen the core EDA growth slip below 10%. I know you're not guiding to 25%, but do you think investors should be prepared for a smoother year or are there other lumpy effects in IP or hardware or anything else that we should keep in mind? And if I had to try to quantify it, if I look at this $1,300,000,000 kind of exiting run rate from Q4, is this sort of the trend line for next year? Just how would you suggest investors get a handle for 2025 because I think this lumpiness has really impacted the stock this year?

Speaker 2

Yes. Vivek, all I would say is that, I mean, 1st 2 quarters were not were atypical for cadence. We have highlighted before like Q1 and Q2 because of certain kind of one time things. But I do believe Q3 is more back to normal, but John can comment more.

Speaker 3

No, I agree. It's certainly Q3 feels like our back to normal quarter. I think Q4 has a lot of upfront revenue and it's unusual again in terms of Q4. And we've got that massive pipeline that we have to convert. We have a lot of work to do there before we can talk about 2025.

Speaker 3

But when I look at 2025, I kind of view Q3 as a more normal quarter for Cadence.

Speaker 12

Okay. And for my follow-up, I saw in the CFO commentary that you have something now called core EDA. You've always given the different segment sales. But if I'm not mistaken, you took SBA out and you have something called core EDA. I'm curious why you chose to do that and do you have a system design and analysis kind of growth gager in mind beyond just a generic kind of double digit.

Speaker 12

What is the organic growth rate that you think your SDA business can achieve over the next number of years?

Speaker 3

And actually I'm asking about 25% again Vivek. Nice try. But look, when we talk about core EDA, we were talking about basically you have core EDA software and you have the like functional verification group and hardware. We talk about core EDA, we talk about those 3 groups combined. The system design analysis, we typically talk about separately.

Speaker 3

And then of course, we have the IP business. The IP business and systems design analysis business are growing really, really strongly right now. But the launch of the new hardware products has resulted in functional verification growing really strongly. But often when hardware is bundled alongside core EDA software, that there's an allocation methodology to apply value between the software and the hardware. So often internally, we look at core EDA, the 3 of them combined.

Speaker 3

If you look at core EDA software, by the end of the year, we're on track to achieve double digits revenue growth on a 3 year CAGR basis, which is the way we track things. But on the functional verification side of things, it will be it looks like it's on track for like high teen growth on a 3 year CAGR basis, like mid to high teen growth. But IP, again, looks very, very strong and SD and A is the strongest of all. And I think it's all those things that Anurag just spoke to.

Speaker 12

Thank you.

Operator

Our next question comes from Clark Jefferies with Piper Sandler.

Speaker 13

Hello. Thank you for taking the question. I wanted to more focus on fiscal 2024 with my questioning around specifically what happened in the quarter versus the full year guide. I mean there was great momentum in the IP business, 59% growth. I was wondering what if you could level set what you're expecting in terms of Q4 IP contribution.

Speaker 13

I know last quarter we talked a lot about IP and systems leading the upfront revenue in the second half and verification maybe being in the high single digits. Is that still fair or true? Just to the broader question of you tightened to full year range, but a beat on Q3, what was happening behind the scenes that revenue landed differently than expected? And then one follow-up.

Speaker 3

Yes, sure, Clark. I don't think revenue landed differently to expect. I mean, basically, we were prudent with our guide in Q3 and it's we feel our team always does its best business when they're not chasing. And I think we were rewarded for that with Q3 business. But similarly, we're being prudent for Q4.

Speaker 3

IP has great momentum. I expect that momentum to carry on into the Q4 as well as SG and A. I think all businesses are performing really, really well now. Anything to add there, Anurush?

Speaker 2

Yes. Just some more comments on the IP business. I mean, of course, Q3 is strong and we expect good growth in Q4. But like any business, we look at it over multiple quarters and multiple years, right? So if you look at IP on a 2 year CAGR, I think it's, I would say, in the 30%, which is still good.

Speaker 2

But Q3, I mean, there's only focus on what each quarter separately. But the key thing in IP growing at, let's say, 30% on a 2 year CAGR basis, I think we are doing finally, we are in a very good position in IP. This is the way I feel. I mean, EDA, we have done historically very well. We are well recognized as the leader in EDA.

Speaker 2

But if you look back like last 3 years, we have not done as well in IP as we could have. But I finally feel that now our IP business is in its strongest position it has been, okay. And there's multiple reasons for that. I mean, one key reason is that we always focus on advanced node, especially with our leading kind of TSMC advanced node. And now at 3 nanometer, 5 nanometer, our PPA is finally industry leading in the IPs we deliver.

Speaker 2

And they are for these kind of enterprise application and that whole area is taking off it. So I think that's the first main reason. The second reason is that we are now working with other foundries like we have highlighted and there is more and more IP development needed for kind of on shoring or front shoring activities throughout the world. And then the third reason is this disaggregation. This 3 d IC, even not just in HPC, but now in laptops and automotive, this aggregation trend and need for IP like UCI and all the other memory interface IPs.

Speaker 2

So I do feel that we have a good portfolio and an IP group is in a very good position, not just for Q3, but on a multiple year CAGR basis.

Speaker 13

Perfect. And just to clarify or follow-up on that, Just I think the number one question we're going to get from investors are, are there going to be remaining execution thresholds with some of the IP business you had anticipated in the second half? Does more of that come in Q4 or did some of it land in Q3? And then just final point around margin outperformance, how would you attribute the margin outperformance that happened in the quarter? Certainly, IP revenue may benefit the sort of optics of incremental margin, but anything to call out in terms of maybe how OpEx discipline came in compared to your expectations?

Speaker 13

Thank you.

Speaker 3

Yes. Sure, Clark. Again, more great questions. The I mean, on the IP side, I think we like I said, we've got great momentum there. You're probably referring to the we did a large contract at the start of the year with milestones that were in the second half of the year and some of those kicked in, of course, in Q3 and triggered revenue.

Speaker 3

There are more that will trigger revenue in Q4, but that's a multiyear contract that will that momentum will should continue on into next year. And then on the margin side, I mean, Cadence is I mean, it's a tremendous business. I mean, the core EDA business is a great foundation for margins and profitable sustainable revenue business that and growth is we scale really well. As we grow in these other areas, a lot of the growth just flows down. Nice to hear you talking about incremental margin.

Speaker 3

Typically, a lot of that revenue growth just flows into operating margin. And you can see when the growth comes through, the impact it has on operating margin is incredible.

Speaker 13

Thank you very much.

Operator

Our next question comes from Harlan Sur with JPMorgan.

Speaker 11

Good afternoon. Thanks for taking my question. Your inventories are up 70% sequentially. That's an all time high. I think it's implying a very strong demand profile and backlog for your new Z3 and X3 hardware systems.

Speaker 11

Is demand exceeding your near term supply and manufacturing capabilities? In other words, is the Q4 shipment profile for your hardware system supply or manufacturing constraint? I'm just trying to get a sense on how many quarters the strong upgrade cycle can extend into next year?

Speaker 3

Yes, Hardin, the demand is very strong for our hardware. But in terms of inventory growth, that's really come as a result of us buying a doing a multiyear contract with a key supplier. We mentioned that on last quarter's call. That's also impacting our operating cash this year, but it was in and around the kind of low to mid €100,000,000 kind of level in terms of purchases for hardware inventory for the next 3 years.

Speaker 11

Perfect. Okay. Thank you for that. And then back to the China business. So as you think about 2025 anniversary in a more normalized business environment for your China business this year, there's a lot of puts and takes, right?

Speaker 11

You've got the hardware upgrade cycle, you've got the potential direct or indirect headwinds from maybe more U. S. Regulatory actions. You've got the macro environment, which in extreme cases maybe does impact design activity. So kind of lots of moving pieces, right?

Speaker 11

But I think that the best leaning indicator over the next few quarters on growth is design starts and planned design starts, right? So Anurud, as you track design starts in China, you track some of their upcoming programs, how does the design activity funnel look? Is it increasing? Is it staying flat? And then when you overlay your hardware upgrade cycle on top of this, what's the early sort of qualitative view on China as you look into next year?

Speaker 11

Would you expect continued acceleration in year over year comps?

Speaker 2

Well, Alan, that's a good question. I mean, 1st overall and then specifically on China. I mean, like we mentioned that China has improved last 2 quarters. I mean, it's difficult to forecast that into next year. But I do think that there is improvement in China overall.

Speaker 2

And also now with our more richer portfolio is also with especially with the auto sector. I mean, what is interesting to me is, of course, China, we have luxury of like in China and other parts work on multiple end markets. And we participate in all the markets that the customers are designing chips for. But what is interesting to see for me to see in China is how well they're doing in automotive. And almost all of those major auto companies are also now designing chips.

Speaker 2

I mean, this is well known now. And so we are glad to work with them both on the SDA, but also the EDA side with the silicon part. So I think we just have to see how it progresses into 2025. But overall, I think design activity is strong in China and elsewhere, especially driven by this AI super cycle and amount of activity we are seeing with the hyperscalers, both in China and, of course, in the U. S.

Speaker 2

And the demand of AI for next several years. So we'll see. We'll continue to monitor that.

Speaker 3

Yes. And Harlan, although, I mean, obviously, we can't predict what 2025 is going to bring. We did go back and back test the last 25 years. It's only the 3rd year that we've seen a down year in China revenue on a dollar basis. And we've never seen 2 down years in a row.

Speaker 3

And I'm pleased to see that Q2 was stronger than Q1 this year, Q3 is stronger than Q2 this year. Pipeline looks strong anecdotally from the team out in China, they're seeing a lot of design activity strength out there. So we wouldn't expect a second down year based on that history, but it's just very hard to predict 25.

Speaker 11

I appreciate that. Thank you for the insights.

Operator

Our next question comes from Reuben Roy with Stifel.

Speaker 14

Thank you. John, I wanted to ask a quick question returning to the bookings pipeline, and I'm sorry, great to hear that. But I know you said it was broad based. Just wondering if we could drill into the hardware part of it just a little bit more. I think historically, you've said that hardware visibility is a little limited relative to the rest of your business.

Speaker 14

I'm just wondering, given that you have this new ramp, has that changed at all? Is your visibility on kind of hardware bookings extending at this point? Or it's kind of similar to previous systems?

Speaker 10

No, typically you've got like 2

Speaker 3

yes, no, great question. I mean typically on the hardware side, you've kind of got a 2 quarter view of the pipeline. Opportunities tend to turn up in the pipeline about 2 quarters at most in advance of when the customer plans to put the hardware into production. Because often it's based on design projects that customers are starting and then they might need a hardware emulation system for that project and they know the project will be like this quarter or next quarter. So typically, we have kind of a 6 month view.

Speaker 3

Now at this time of the year, 6 month view is tremendous because there's a lot that happens in Q4 every year. Q4 is always a strong bookings quarter for us. By the time we obviously, with a strong pipeline and everything, we've got to convert a bunch of that. But you have a great history of converting that. But we'd like you to just let us convert that now in Q4 and we'll come back to you as soon as we close Q4 and give you an outlook on 2025.

Speaker 14

Understood. Thanks, John. And then a quick one, I hope, for Anurud, just kind of thinking through what you said on some of the new AI kind of areas that you're working on. You mentioned NVIDIA and NIMZ and NIMO and I think your competitors talked a little bit about that. I imagine you would characterize that as a later phase AI revenue opportunity, but just wondering if you could maybe talk through how we should think about timing of when we might see some of those types of products hit the market?

Speaker 14

And also, you said that you're building custom applications. Are you getting inbound requests from customers like hyperscalers or otherwise for that type of AI, feature set?

Speaker 2

Well, one thing I would like to highlight is that is our JEDI platform. So it's an enterprise data and AI platform. And the way we go to market with that and it supports like multiple, Gen AI solutions. So it so we become almost like LLM agnostic. We can plug in different and different customers will want like different kind of engines in there.

Speaker 2

But it becomes like a main deployment vehicle and it works with all our tools and all our major 5 AI platforms. So we give that flexibility to us depending on which some customers may want different kind of AI solutions there. And then that platform can also be used to customize, not just our solutions, but any customer specific solutions can be deployed through JEDI. And JEDI also works both on the cloud and on prem because some customers, some really big customers don't want the AI to go to the cloud. So in that case, we have an on prem.

Speaker 2

So I think JEDI and we have worked on this JEDI for several years, gives a unique position to Cadence to deploy these AI solutions and multiple kind of LLMs and ways to go to market.

Speaker 15

Thank you, Anurag.

Operator

Our next question comes from Siti Panagrahi with Mizuho.

Speaker 10

Thanks for squeezing me in. And Anirudh, it's good to be on the call. I just initiated coverage. So I want to keep it at a high level and probably just for interest of time, one question here. When I look at your 3 years revenue cracker trend, it has been accelerating from single digit to now mid teens.

Speaker 10

And Anil, you talked about so many growth driver and even products, new products coming to market. I'm wondering how do you rank order this growth opportunity and product when you think about the growth in the foreseeable future? And what gives you that confidence to sustain this kind of double digit revenue growth?

Speaker 2

Well, thank you for the question and also thank you for initiating coverage. I mean, as we have said before, I think one thing just want to highlight is we are always looking at revenue growth, which has improved, like you mentioned, through a lot of these systemic drivers, but always at the same time profitability, which has also improved and continues to improve every year. So and put that together, that of course delivers results to our shareholders. And even in Q3, right, not only we did better on revenue, but also on profitability. So I think there are a lot of drivers, a lot of them driven by AI and then AI moving to the edge and our move into doing better in new areas like SD and A, but also IP.

Speaker 2

Like I mentioned, I'm optimistic about our IP business going forward. But at the same time, we put a focus on profitability. So we'll continue to manage that going forward.

Speaker 11

Great. Thank you.

Operator

Our final question comes from Joshua Tilton with Wolfe Research.

Speaker 15

Hey guys, thanks for squeezing Mike in. I want to start with a bit of a nuance question, although I think it is important. John, you talked to how previously you have seen down years in China, but you've never seen 2 down years in a row. And I guess you mentioned you're data driven, you looked at the historical numbers, but can you give us any sense of what helped drive the recovery a year after you had a down year? And what I'm trying to get at it is, do I have to believe in some type of bigger hardware demand or more upfront contribution or something along the lines of things that may not be recurring?

Speaker 15

Or is it just more a function of we had a weak year and there was a return to normal demand environment going forward? I guess I'm just trying to understand outside of history, what is similar this year versus the previous years where you've seen down years and why you don't expect to once again not see 2 net users interrupt?

Speaker 3

Yes. Okay. Thanks for the opportunity to provide a little bit more color. Yes, we look back over the last 25 years and we've seen like tremendous momentum in design activity amongst our customer base, a growing customer base across China. There were only 2 previous years before this year where we saw a downtick in China revenue on a year over year basis.

Speaker 3

2,008, I know 2,008 has some of the authentic qualities to it. But 2,008 was also a year that we changed from an upfront revenue model to a ratable revenue model. And I think that's why it took a couple of years to get back to a new high in China. But then since then, it's only 2021. 2021 dipped China revenue dipped from 2020, but it recovered to a new high in 2022.

Speaker 3

And now incidentally, that was we launched new hardware systems and we do find that there is a correlation between hardware revenue and China revenue. Hardware revenue tends to pull through more China revenue for us on the software side. And I think we're seeing a little bit of that this year in that the new hardware that's been launched is selling more and being delivered more outside of China. I would expect more of that to go to China next year and it will help improve our software revenue. Also, if you look at this year, China, it dipped in Q1, but it's been recovering since Q2 has been higher, Q3 has been higher.

Speaker 3

And like I said, as hardware recovers out there, I think it will pull through more software revenue.

Speaker 15

Super helpful. And then just maybe one very quick follow-up. Any updates on what you guys are or just in general what the contribution from beta was in the quarter? And if you're still on track or expecting $40,000,000 for the full year or if we should expect more from your original comment?

Speaker 3

So we're seeing a big contribution from beta when you include the pull through revenue that we're getting across for all our automotive customers as a result of selling traditional cadence technology alongside beta. But we're but it's a small tuck in. We're not guiding beta separately.

Speaker 10

Got it. Super helpful guys. Thank you

Speaker 15

so much for squeezing me.

Speaker 3

Bruce, thank you.

Operator

I will now turn it back to Anurud Devgn for closing remarks.

Speaker 2

Thank you all for joining us this afternoon. It's an exciting time for Cadence with strong business momentum and growing opportunities with semiconductor and system customers. We launched the fem.ai initiative and committed to an initial investment of $20,000,000 to lead the gender equity revolution in the AI workspace. This is also led through our cadence giving foundation. With a world class employee base, we continue delivering to our innovative roadmap and working hard to delight our customers and partners.

Speaker 2

On behalf of our Board of Directors, we thank our customers, partners and investors for their continued trust and confidence in Cadence.

Operator

Thank you for participating in today's Cadence Third Quarter 2024 Earnings Conference Call. This concludes today's call. You may now disconnect.

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Earnings Conference Call
Cadence Design Systems Q3 2024
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