NASDAQ:APLS Apellis Pharmaceuticals Q4 2023 Earnings Report $18.20 +0.04 (+0.22%) Closing price 04/17/2025 04:00 PM EasternExtended Trading$18.20 0.00 (-0.03%) As of 04/17/2025 04:32 PM Eastern Extended trading is trading that happens on electronic markets outside of regular trading hours. This is a fair market value extended hours price provided by Polygon.io. Learn more. Earnings HistoryForecast Apellis Pharmaceuticals EPS ResultsActual EPS-$0.73Consensus EPS -$0.73Beat/MissMet ExpectationsOne Year Ago EPS-$1.50Apellis Pharmaceuticals Revenue ResultsActual Revenue$146.38 millionExpected Revenue$143.34 millionBeat/MissBeat by +$3.04 millionYoY Revenue Growth+545.90%Apellis Pharmaceuticals Announcement DetailsQuarterQ4 2023Date2/27/2024TimeQ4 2023 Earnings ReleaseConference Call DateTuesday, February 27, 2024Conference Call Time8:30AM ETUpcoming EarningsApellis Pharmaceuticals' Q1 2025 earnings is scheduled for Tuesday, May 6, 2025, with a conference call scheduled at 8:30 AM ET. Check back for transcripts, audio, and key financial metrics as they become available.Q1 2025 Earnings ReportConference Call ResourcesConference Call AudioConference Call TranscriptSlide DeckPress Release (8-K)Annual Report (10-K)Earnings HistoryCompany ProfileSlide DeckFull Screen Slide DeckPowered by Apellis Pharmaceuticals Q4 2023 Earnings Call TranscriptProvided by QuartrFebruary 27, 2024 ShareLink copied to clipboard.There are 15 speakers on the call. Operator00:00:00Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you for standing by, and welcome to the Apellis Pharmaceuticals 4th Quarter 2023 Earnings Conference Call. At this time, all participants are in a listen only mode. After the speakers' presentation, there will be a question and answer Please be advised today's conference is being recorded. I would now hand the conference over to your speaker host, Meredith Keiser, Senior Vice President, Investor Relations and Strategic Finance. Operator00:00:28Please go ahead. Speaker 100:00:32Good morning, and thank you for joining us to discuss Apellas' Q4 and full year 2023 financial results. With me on the call are Co Founder and Chief Executive Officer, Doctor. Cedric Francois Chief Operating Officer, Adam Townsend Chief Medical Officer, Doctor. Caroline Bommel and Chief Financial Officer, Tim Sullivan. Before we begin, let me point out that we will be making forward looking statements that are based on our current expectations and beliefs. Speaker 100:00:58These statements are subject to certain risks and uncertainties and actual results may differ materially. I encourage you to consult the risk factors discussed in our SEC filings for additional detail. Now, I'll turn the call over to Cedric. Speaker 200:01:10Thank you, Meredith, and thank you all for joining us this morning. As I reflect on this past year, I am extremely proud of our team and all of our achievements in 2023. Our 2 commercial products SYFOVRI and Empaverin are making meaningful differences for patients. The year ended with SYFOVRI in a very strong position and we remain encouraged by the continuous uptake and high compliance rates for empathetic and PNH. We also had multiple positive data readouts including up to 3 years of efficacy and safety data from both of our approved therapies. Speaker 200:01:49While 2023 certainly had its challenges, our accomplishments and our resilience position us well for continued execution in 2024 and to deliver on our mission for patients now and in the future. Let me share some details on this past year and our priorities for 2024. Beginning with SYFOPRI. We recently celebrated Xyfobri's 1 year approval anniversary and what a year it has been. The launch has exceeded our expectations even with the unexpected challenges we faced last summer. Speaker 200:02:27More than 200,000 SYFOVRI doses have now been distributed to physician practices since launch through mid February and we estimate that approximately 215,000 Cyfol 3 injections have been administered to patients through mid February, including our Phase III clinical trials. These numbers underscore the retina community's confidence in the benefits of site filgrin and central role it plays in improving patients' lives. And importantly, based on these numbers, the risk of developing retinal vasculitis remains rare at an estimated rate of approximately 0.01% per injection. In the Q4, we reported $114,000,000 to SYFYVI U. S. Speaker 200:03:15Net product revenue. We achieved $275,000,000 in SYFYVI revenues for the full year. While we have experienced modest seasonality in the Q1 so far, SYFYVI continues to show meaningful growth and we look forward to bringing it to more and more patients throughout the year. In 2024, our priorities with Cyflorin are to maximize access to patients in need in the U. S. Speaker 200:03:45And to bring Cyflorin to patients with GA worldwide. Key to these are our commercial and medical activities, including building on the relationships we've already established in the retina community. Given our global expansion goal with CYF4BRI, let me comment on the European Union. As you know, we received a negative opinion by the Committee of Medicinal Products for Human Use or CHMP for the marketing application of SYFOVRI in the EU. While this is disappointing, we remain steadfast in our efforts given the more than 2,500,000 GA patients in need of treatment across Europe. Speaker 200:04:29The feedback and support we have received for SYKFOR RE from the physician and patient communities in Europe has been extraordinary. We have been informed of several letters sent to EMEA from multiple European retina organizations, highlighting the need for new treatments and how important CyPharmacy will be for patients. As such, we are initiating a reexamination of our application, which includes revising our dossier to ensure that key questions are addressed. We expect a final opinion in connection with this reexamination to be issued at an upcoming CHMP meeting in the Q2. If positive, a decision by the European Commission is anticipated in the Q3. Speaker 200:05:16To be clear, and as we've said many times before, this is not going to be easy. It will be an uphill battle and we do not know the likelihood of success at this stage, but we strongly believe in our data, including analyses that many experts agreed demonstrate a functional benefit with cytochrome treatment and we will continue to work closely with the CHMP and the retina community throughout the process. Turning to Enviva. We generated $24,000,000 in 4th quarter U. S. Speaker 200:05:48Net product revenue $91,000,000 for the full year. The Epapheri injector, an innovative and first of its kind high-tech volume injector was approved and launched last fall. We've been very pleased with the feedback and adoption so far. And in 2024, we will remain focused on maximizing our market position in PNH and also look forward to the Phase 3 data readouts for systemicxitacopan in C3g and ICMPGN, 2 rare and debilitating kidney diseases. Our Phase 3 value study is fully enrolled and we expect top line data from this study midyear. Speaker 200:06:33Over the past couple of years, we've been very focused on our commercial products and new launches, but we have other exciting earlier stage programs advancing. Let me shift to our 4th priority for 2024, which is to progress our early R and D pipeline with an eye to the long term. In addition to the AbbVie initiatives in C3G and ICMPGN, we are focused on our siRNA program, APL-three thousand and seven, which is now in a Phase 1 dose escalation study with data expected later this year. Additionally, we are advancing the gene editing program with Beam on which we also expect to share more this year. We are entering 2024 from a position of strength with an unwavering commitment to address unmet needs for patients and to create even greater value for our shareholders. Speaker 200:07:31And with that, I will now turn it over to Adam to discuss our commercial and medical affairs activity. Speaker 300:07:38Thank you, Cedric. Speaker 400:07:39It was a big year commercially for Opellis with the launch of SYFOBRI in GA and the commercialization of Emproveli in PNH. Starting with SYFOVRI, in the 4th quarter, we delivered approximately 62,000 doses to physician practices, including 55,000 commercial vials and 6,400 samples, generating $114,000,000 in U. S. Net product revenue. This strong growth underscores the rebound in weekly demand that began in August of 2023. Speaker 400:08:17Our execution was driven by meaningful engagement with our key stakeholders, physicians, patients and payers. We continue to see weekly orders coming from both new and existing physician practices with a double digit number of new sites ordering SYFOGRI every week since launch. Patients are motivated to seek treatment and the vast majority of physicians are treating their patients with Xiphobri every 6 to 8 weeks, reinforcing how much doctors and patients appreciate a more flexible dosing regimen. And we continue to have robust payer coverage. We are encouraged by the demand growth we are seeing in the Q1 so far. Speaker 400:09:04January February have been 2 of our biggest months since launch. However, as expected, we did see some seasonality in January as a result of Medicare recertifications as well as weather delays affecting doctor visits and product shipments. These seasonality trends are consistent with what has been seen with some of the anti VEGF products in the wet AMD market. Today, SYFOVRI is the number one chosen GA treatment with the current market share of approximately 90%. At launch, we estimated that there were 1,000,000 patients with GA in the U. Speaker 400:09:44S. Now that treatments are available for GA patients, we are learning that this population may be even bigger than we expected with estimates suggesting there may be up to 1,500,000 patients. Going forward, we expect to continue to build this market and maintain our market leading position. We will be laser focused on executing our strategy, highlighting the key advantages of SYFOPRI, which include increasing effects over time with more than 40% reductions in GA lesion growth demonstrated in our GALE extension study, Extensive experience with approximately 215,000 injections estimated to have been administered between our clinical trials and real world experience. And more vision saved for patients, meaning treatment with Xiphobri has been shown to preserve visual function longer in multiple post hoc analyses. Speaker 400:10:49Now to Epivale. The positive trends witnessed across the key leading indicators for this patient population have continued through the end of 2023. In the Q4, Empaveli generated approximately $24,000,000 in U. S. Net product sales, resulting in a total of $91,000,000 for the full year. Speaker 400:11:12Notably, approximately 10% of demand in 2023 was from treatment naive patients and compliance rates remain incredibly high at 97%. We also continue to have a very strong safety profile. We have over 1400 patient years of systemic pegcetagopalan exposure and have had 0 cases of meningococcal infection and very low rates of thrombosis. We are facing a more competitive market with the recent approval of an oral product in PNH. And I expect the convenience of a twice a day pill will be appealing to some patients. Speaker 400:11:56I previously commented on the positive feedback since approval of the Empivendi injector. By simplifying administration and offering greater mobility, we believe the injector elevates the patient experience and fortifies our competitive position. Before I hand it over to Caroline, I'll close by saying that I am incredibly proud of both the SYFOVRI and Empivalli medical and commercial teams. They did an outstanding job throughout 2023, working night and day to bring these two medicines to physicians and patients in need. With that, let me turn the call over to Caroline. Speaker 100:12:36Thanks, Adam, and good morning, everyone. We had an active year within the medical community for both SYFOVRI and Empivelli. In November, we presented data from our GALE extension study, which followed 3 years of continuous treatment with SYFOBRI at the American Academy of Ophthalmology Annual Meeting. These data continue to show increasing effects over time with both monthly and every other month Xfobri dosing, a seminal feature of SYFOVRI's efficacy profile. As Adam just highlighted, SYFOVRI reduced GA lesion growth by more than 40% in patients with non subfovial GA lesions in year 3 compared to projected sham. Speaker 100:13:22This is the largest treatment effect shown in GA to date. 2024 has already been a busy year so far in terms of medical meetings. Most recently, we were at the Macular Society, where we had a significant presence with 3 oral data presentations, including our Gale 36 month data, a matching adjusted indirect comparison or MAIC analysis using our 24 month data and post hoc microperometry analysis demonstrating preservation of function in the retina following treatment with XIFAVIRI. Turning to empovelli. We, along with our partner Sobe, presented post hoc long term efficacy and safety data on empovelli@ashannualmeetingindecember. Speaker 100:14:15These data showed that treatment with empovelli can help PNH patients achieve rapid and sustained control of their disease over the long term. Furthermore, it is impressive that the majority of patients remain transfusion free for up to 3 years, alleviating a significant and common disease burden for many patients living with PNH. Additionally, at Kidney Week, we had the opportunity to present new data from our Phase 2 NOLBEL study, investigating pegzetacoplin for the treatment of post transplant recurrence of C3g and ICMPGN. C3g and ICMPGN are diseases in which patients have a 50% chance of progressing to end stage renal disease or kidney transplantation over the course of 5 to 10 years. Between these two indications, there are approximately 5,000 potential patients in the U. Speaker 100:15:19S. And up to 8,000 in Europe with no approved treatments available. This year, we are looking forward to the top line data from our Phase 3 VALYANT study, which we expect mid year. VALIENT enrolled 124 patients, split fifty-fifty between treatment and placebo, aged 12 and up with C3g or primary ICMPGN. It is the only study to include both native kidney patients and patients who have recurrent disease after receiving a kidney transplant. Speaker 100:15:58Study participants were randomized to receive pegzetacoplin or placebo twice weekly for 26 weeks. Following this 26 week randomized controlled period, patients will proceed to a 26 week open label phase in which all patients receive pegzidicopalan. The primary endpoint of the study is the reduction from baseline in urine protein to creatinine ratio or UPCR as compared to placebo at week 26. I'd like to shift gears and comment on the Cascades Phase 3 study evaluating the efficacy and safety of pegcetacoplin in patients with cold agglutinin disease or CAD. As Sobe previously disclosed, the decision was made to end the study due to decreased medical need in the CAD space and a limited number of patients eligible for the study. Speaker 100:16:55This is not due to any safety concerns and the efficacy has not been evaluated due to the study being masked. I'd like to express our gratitude to the CAG community for their support and collaboration. Sobeys working with study investigators to manage the next steps for those enrolled in the study with their welfare as the priority. Now, I will turn the call over to Tim for a review of the financials. Tim? Speaker 400:17:25Thank you, Caroline. Speaker 500:17:27I will provide a brief overview of our financials and Speaker 600:17:30you can find additional details in the Speaker 500:17:31press release that we issued earlier this morning. Total revenue for the Q4 and full year 2023 was $146,000,000 $397,000,000 respectively. Quarterly revenue consisted of $114,000,000 in site full rate and $24,000,000 in Empa Valley U. S. Net product revenue and $8,000,000 in additional licensing and other revenue associated with the Sobeys collaboration. Speaker 500:17:56Full year revenue consists of $275,000,000 in SYBOVRI and $91,000,000 in Emflivelli U. S. Net product revenue and $30,000,000 in additional licensing and other revenue associated with Sobeys collaboration. Turning to the rest of the P and L. For the Q4 and full year, cost of sales was $20,000,000 $58,500,000 respectively. Speaker 500:18:19R and D expenses were $69,000,000 $354,000,000 respectively. G and A expenses were $142,000,000 $501,000,000 respectively, and we reported a net loss of $89,000,000 $529,000,000 respectively. I'd like to point out a few items in our financial statements that will help in evaluating our business. First, we recorded accounts receivable of $206,000,000 at year end, which is primarily associated with payment terms that we provide to the SYPO REIT distributors. The accounts receivable line item has increased along with the increasing SYFOVRI sales and is in line with typical payment terms. Speaker 500:19:012nd, as we shared previously, we are now categorizing the majority of medical affairs and certain other costs in G and A instead of in R and D. This represents an approximately $22,000,000 shift from R and Speaker 200:19:12D to G and A in Speaker 500:19:14the Q4 $41,000,000 in the second half of twenty twenty three. No reclassifications were necessary for prior periods. However, it is important to note this shift when reviewing trends in our operating expenses. And finally, our operating expenses do not yet reflect the ongoing efficiencies that we expect from our restructuring last August due to severance and winding down of certain projects. As I said last quarter, we expect to realize these efficiencies beginning in 2024. Speaker 500:19:43And while I'm not going to get into detailed numbers, what I will say is that we expect our total operating expenses in 2024 to be less than our total expenses in 2023. Turning to our balance sheet. As of December 31, 2023, we had $351,000,000 in cash and cash equivalents. We continuously evaluate ways in which to further strengthen our financial position. And with that in mind, today we announced that we entered into agreements to unwind approximately 80% of the capped call associated with the $425,000,000 in convertible notes that we hold in treasury. Speaker 500:20:19We expect total aggregate net cash proceeds to be up to $125,000,000 including approximately 100,000,000 dollars following this transaction and up to $25,000,000 in additional net cash proceeds if we unwind the remaining capital. The unwinding transactions will be settled based on a 7 day averaging period beginning on and including February 27, 2024. As of December 31, 2023, the aggregate principal balance of the remaining convertible notes net of unamortized issuance costs was $93,000,000 We now believe that our cash and cash equivalents combined with the cash generated from the cash called unwind and from sales of SEDOVERE and EMBOVELE will be sufficient to fund our projected operating expenses and capital expenditures for the foreseeable future. That said, we will continue to evaluate opportunities to further optimize our balance sheet and maintain an appropriate cash balance at all times. We have multiple levers that are available to us and as always, we will be incredibly thoughtful and opportunistic in any decision we make. Speaker 500:21:27I will now hand the call back over to Cedric for closing remarks. Cedric? Speaker 200:21:32Thanks, Tim. This was a strong finish to the year. We are building on our success and learnings and the evidence of our ongoing strength continues to be seen in the numbers and feedback we are seeing. We are headed into the year with renewed energy and an acute focus in our goal of putting patients first and elevating the standard of care in all disease areas in which we work. With this, we are determined to execute on our 4 key priorities, continuing to expand patient access to SYFOVRI in the U. Speaker 200:22:04S, while also working to bring the therapy worldwide Maximizing Empavity in PNH and then expanding in this new indication in C3g and ICMPGN. And finally, progressing our early pipeline including the siRNA program and our collaboration with Beam. As always, we are looking forward to sharing updates as they become available and continuing our efforts towards becoming the global leader in complement medicine. Let us now open the call for questions. Operator? Operator00:22:37Thank Our first question comes from John Miller with Evercore. Your line is open. Speaker 700:23:01Hey guys, thanks for taking the question. Congrats again on a great Q4 and a great reacceleration of the launch. I would love to start on the EU reexamination. Centric, you mentioned that you're getting a lot of enthusiasm from patient groups from docs in the EU. I would love to get a sense from you for how much impact that doc enthusiasm will have on the reexamination and maybe why that wasn't helpful in the first round? Speaker 700:23:31What's changed now that wasn't the truth in the first examination? And then secondly on the commercial launch, if even accounting for seasonality and is it fair to expect that Q1 will still be growing robustly relative to Q4? Do you expect that March orders will be making up for Medicare recertification delays in January, February? Speaker 600:23:58Thank you so much, John. So first of all, as it relates to the European Union, so these are these letters are letters that are not sent to us. They are sent to independently from us to the review organization and then we receive them via that route. So these are important letters of support. I think they highlight the unmet medical need. Speaker 600:24:21They highlight the support that physicians have for this product and their desire to make it available to their patients in Europe. Will it have an impact? That is really impossible to tell for us. As we've always mentioned, this will be an uphill battle. It is rare for these appeals to be successful. Speaker 600:24:38But of course, having the support from the patients and the physicians is important. Then as it relates to the commercial question, I will hand that over to Adam. Speaker 400:24:46Yes. Hey, John, it's Adam. So yes, we did see seasonality impact January and the start of February. So that the vast majority of that was due to recertifications and we also had a few weather delays. So interestingly, right, we did some homework and the seasonality is always consistent and we saw it with in our homework with some of the anti VEGF products over the years. Speaker 400:25:11For example, I mean, we believe that EYLEA has not seen growth above 5% in Q1 versus Q4 over approximately the last 10 years, with several years resulting in a quarter on quarter decline in Q1. Tends to be due to recertification seasonality and weather, etcetera, other demands. We have seen 2 of our biggest months since launch in January February. And your question was, do you expect to see that continue in March? We think we're through all of the recertifications. Speaker 400:25:41Hopefully, the weather stays friendly to us. So we continue to expect to see solid numbers in March as we move forward. Speaker 700:25:53Makes sense. And maybe one for Tim, or I'll get back in Speaker 500:25:56the queue while I'm at the play. Speaker 600:26:00Go ahead, John. Why don't you ask it quickly? I think that's easier. Speaker 800:26:04I was just going to Speaker 700:26:05ask him about the runway now through the foreseeable future. I remember at JPMorgan, you were saying that it was plausible you could reach profitability and be funded through the foreseeable future, but that you might not want to do that. And I would just want to get a sense for how that's changed since JPMorgan and whether you're really actively looking for ways to bolster cash position and give yourself a little bit more flexibility or if you think you've done that with these cap calls? Speaker 500:26:36Well, so thanks, John. So the good news is with the capped call with $100,000,000 $120,000,000 to $125,000,000 essentially non dilutive capital in addition to the $351,000,000 we reported at year end. That puts us in a great financial position. And as we mentioned, in our scenarios that we project that should get us to through without having to raise capital necessarily. I mean, it could be technically done. Speaker 500:27:04But we also have certain things like our SFJ liability, which that's $200,000,000 in cash out the door over the next 2 years. That could put us in a position where we don't really have an ideal cash balance. So the good news is we're in a pretty strong position and we have a lot of options available to us to opportunistically make sure we have a sufficient cash balance that could be refinancing SFJ, that could be a number of things. So again, we'll be thoughtful and opportunistic as we always have been and that pretty much covers it. Speaker 700:27:42Fair enough. Thanks so much. Speaker 200:27:44Thanks. Thank you, Jim. Operator00:27:46One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Tazeen Ahmad with BFA Securities. Your line is open. Speaker 100:28:01Just a point of clarification, Adam. Are you expecting to see growth in 1Q relative to 4Q on sales? I just want to clarify, you didn't mention the EYLEA historic and wanted to make sure it's not flat to down. And then secondly, I have a question on 3,007. What are you expecting to show for this siRNA program and what potential indications do you think it has promise in? Speaker 100:28:29Thanks. Speaker 400:28:32Hey, Celine, it's Adam. So yes, I mean, we continue to see growth in February and we expect to continue to see growth in March moving forward. As I said, January February were 2 of our biggest months since launch. You also asked about samples. So we continue to provide samples to our U. Speaker 400:28:50S. Physicians and we expect to continue to do that, especially Speaker 200:28:54as we're still in what Speaker 400:28:55I would call the early phases of this launch. Interestingly, we didn't see sampling increase in the Q1, which I'll be honest, I thought it probably would as we were going through the recertifications. But sampling will continue to be there as we move forward. So hopefully that answers your first question. And I'll hand over to Cedric. Speaker 600:29:16Thank you, Adam. So, Tasim, on 3,007, so this is in the escalation phase in healthy subject. It is the first of several things that are coming out of the preclinical realm now, things that we're very excited about. I will talk about more in the years to come as well. So what we're hoping to see there in the healthy volunteer phase is, of course, how much we can knock down C3 and how durable that will be in these subjects. Speaker 600:29:43The indications that we are going to pursue, we are for now keeping confidential, But we of course have a what we believe is a very exciting development plan in store for that product. Operator00:29:59Thank you. One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Anupam Rama with JPMorgan. Your line is open. Speaker 400:30:12Hey, guys. Thanks so much for taking Speaker 500:30:14the question. Adam, I wanted to ask you a quick question. What is driving your commentary about the GA population size here in the U. S. Being closer to 1,500,000 versus I think what you've previously talked about is about 1,000,000 patients? Speaker 500:30:29Thanks so Speaker 400:30:30much. Yes. Thanks, Adam. Pam, so I'll answer and then I'll hand to Caroline as well if she has any comments. So one thing we found with our interactions with physicians is, one of our work prior to launch was sizing an opportunity that was based on a prevalence data, but also having discussions pre launch with physicians about how many patients that they think they have. Speaker 400:30:52And one thing we found is when you're first to market launch, you'll find a lot of patients that weren't categorized as GA, having GA because there was no treatments were lost to follow-up in terms of sitting with their optometrists or something like that. So we spent a large amount of effort to drive patients to go and get tested and check their vision at their optometrists. And then if they are diagnosed with GA move into the clinic of a retina physician or an injecting physician. So in those interactions, we're starting to find that those patients that potentially were lost to follow-up have now been diagnosed with GI and are moving into the practices. So that's how we believe based on those interactions that the number is the market is bigger than we had first anticipated. Speaker 400:31:36Caroline, do you want to add anything from a doctor perspective? Speaker 100:31:40Sure. Thank you. I think that GA story is getting out there, not only to retina physicians and other eye care specialists, but to patients. And this has really helped to drive it. The other thing is that now we have that we have a treatment, all of the patients that we've been seeing that have neovascular wet AMD in one eye, we're looking more closely at their fellow eye and seeing, I think, that there's GA in those patients that had previously just been observed. Speaker 100:32:12So, the number of patients seems to be greater and continues to be more in my practice. Speaker 500:32:22Thanks so much for taking our question. Operator00:32:25One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Salveen Richter with Goldman Sachs. Your line is open. Speaker 100:32:38Great. Good morning and thank you for taking our question. This is Elizabeth on for Salveen. Two questions from us on the EU reexamination of the application of SYFOVRI. So first, you noted that you had revised rapporteurs have been identified and if there's any color you could provide on them with respect to them providing potentially a new perspective compared to the first set of rapporteurs? Speaker 600:33:17Thank you, Elizabeth. Great to hear you. So in the revision, we don't provide that detail, of course, but what's important is to educate, of course, to understand this disease of geographic atrophy and how that works as it relates to the functional endpoints. We have, as you mentioned, 2 new repertoires now. These are going to provide a very fresh view at what we have presented. Speaker 600:33:42And we have new analyses available. We continue to generate data, as you know, in the GAL extension study as well. So, look, as we've always said, we believe that we have strong evidence, of course, not in a pre specified prospective trial, but based on what we gathered throughout our very large data set. And that is what we will now present to these new repertoires with more focus and by making some concessions maybe on the label, but with a path forward, we hope. Speaker 100:34:17Got it. Understood. Thank you. Operator00:34:20One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Ygal Nochomovitz with Citigroup. Your line is open. Speaker 900:34:34Hi, great. Thanks, Cedric and team. Cedric, I appreciate as you pointed out that it's not going to be easy for the CHMP reexamination. It's an uphill battle. You've mentioned the micropromitry data. Speaker 900:34:45You've shown us the post hoc BCVA data. There's another metric, which maybe you could talk about. I don't think you've discussed it before, the electroretinogram, the ERG. It's a very precise measure of electrical activity in the retina. Have you looked at that? Speaker 900:35:00Do you have any data there? Is that something that you could potentially include in the future that could support the claim that there is a functional benefit even though you don't see it in the imaging or in the post hoc BCBA? Thanks. Speaker 600:35:17Thank you so much, Yigal. So ERG, I will hand it over to Caroline to comment on that next step, is not the type of examination that you could use to look at a functional response in geographic atrophy. Again, there's like a resolution problem with that from what I understand, but Caroline can talk about that more. What I think is important here is that the data that we have on macroprimetry is very strong, right? And it's data that again, the longer you treat patients, the more you see these benefits increase over time. Speaker 600:35:47And that is also reflected in the functional measurements that we have. So we will put all of that together in that package. We will consider on what we can do prospectively. That will take time, of course. But for everybody in the future to continue to study this. Speaker 600:36:04But for now, I think we have a strong package with clear evidence that ERG is definitely not something that is part of that equation. Caroline, I don't know if you want to Speaker 100:36:12Thank you. CRG is something that absolutely is used for clinical studies for inherited retinal diseases. It gives a gross response to function and is less used for something like geographic lab streak. But actually, our microproprietary data gives very similar sort of data to an ERG, but in a more directed fashion. I think the story of the cyfobry is it's looking at the overall picture of what SYFOVRI has to add. Speaker 100:36:45And when we present this, it's very meaningful for doctors at meetings. We talk about the imaging parameters, how SYFOLRI reduces growth of GA, which alone in itself is highly meaningful. We talk about the AI parameters. And then we talk about all the functional data that we have, which is microperometry, time to vision loss, and other parameters that we've given at the clinical meeting. So I think that no one else has the amount of the robust microperometry data that we have in such a large patient group and it really speaks to physicians. Speaker 100:37:21And it's really just presenting the entire Cypropri story to the EMA and really educating the EMA on the story. Speaker 900:37:31Okay. Thank you. Carolyn and Cedric. And then just one for Adam. You mentioned, Adam, the 90% share. Speaker 900:37:38Is that new starts or is that existing or is that everybody? Can you just split that out if possible? Speaker 400:37:46Yes. That's thanks Yigal. Yes, that's the total market share. So we're the number one beating GA drug. Speaker 900:37:55Okay. Thank you very much. Operator00:37:58One moment for our next question. Next question comes from Steve Seedhouse with Raymond James. Your line is open. Speaker 1000:38:11Great. Thanks for taking the question. I wanted to ask about a couple of specific parameters as it pertains to the SYFOVRI launch. First, can you comment on patient persistence or discontinuation rates in the real world? 2nd, just the interval between doses, is it closer to 8 weeks or 6 weeks? Speaker 1000:38:31What's the sort of average dose interval? And then also net price or gross to net adjustment we should be thinking about as well? Thanks. Speaker 600:38:41Thank you, Steve. Maybe Caroline, you can comment on what we've seen with this continuation and then Adam will talk about the pathology and the gross to it. Speaker 100:38:52Overall, from what I hear from physicians and what I've seen is that patients are highly motivated and actually in some ways are very comforted to know the exact number of injections that they might be receiving over a year and the following years. With anti VEGF, it's a we often use treatment extend, so it can be a little more variable. But I think that the majority of physicians in the real world are dosing every 6 to 8 weeks with patients and patients seem to be returning for their follow ups. There was one group that looked at this, a large retina group that found very high levels of clients in the patients. Speaker 400:39:32Yes. Just to build on that too, Steve, it's Adam. We're still in the we just got past the 1st year, so it's still early in the launch and we found that the vast majority of patients are really committed to receiving the treatment as Caroline just described beautifully. So I think to the second part of your question, we are seeing the vast majority being every 6 to 8 weeks. It tends to skew closer to 6 weeks, but that flexibility of every other month's dosing and that range allows physicians to move appointments around particularly when weather impacts etcetera, etcetera. Speaker 400:40:12So we truly believe that the every other month dosing as we call it 6 to 8 weeks is a real competitive advantage for us and that the vast majority of patients are choosing that frequency. I'll hand the gross to net question over Speaker 500:40:27to Tim. Yes. Thanks, Adam. So in terms of gross to net, we don't guide on that. I think our previous guidance something between 10% 20%. Speaker 500:40:37But in our 10 ks, we do have some pretty good disclosure over the past year in terms of blended disclosure, both SYFOVRI and EBITDAVELI, but it has chargebacks, discounts and fees laid out, government and other rebates and returns. And what you can see there is a provision related to sales in the current year that gets you kind of to the midpoint of that. That's on a historical basis. We don't say what that is going forward, but yes, sort of towards the middle. Speaker 1000:41:04Thanks so much. I just have one clarification, because Adam mentioned, I think, sampling you didn't see sampling increase in 1Q so far. I'm just curious, is that relative to 4Q or relative to what? Because in 4Q, it was down I think relative to like it was 6 we just reported 6,400 relative to 10,000 in the prior quarter. So I'm just curious what's the reference to what's the reference point for that comment? Speaker 400:41:31Yes. I was a little surprised. I'll be honest with you. Our assumption going this is the 1st January February we've had right where recertifications were new to us. So our assumption prior to that was that some physicians would reach for a sample during this process. Speaker 400:41:48But I actually think that our sampling rate was relatively flat, did not increase. It did not increase versus Q4 too dramatically. And I think that's because we were relatively efficient in getting through the re verification process. So my assumption on something going up prior to those months turned out to be wrong. So I do expect sampling to continue. Speaker 400:42:14I do expect it to be continue to be flat quarter on quarter. As we drive new accounts to start, they tend to reach for less samples and with our J code, it's very easy for these accounts to get reimbursed for cyfobry. So hopefully that answers your question. Speaker 200:42:33Yes. Thanks so much. Operator00:42:36One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Colleen Cussey with Baird. Your line is Speaker 200:42:46open. Great. Speaker 100:42:48Thanks. Good morning. Speaker 1100:42:49Congrats on the progress. A couple of commercial questions from us. What share of the patients on Cyclo Verde today are receiving bilateral injections versus 1 injection or injection 1 eye? And then following up on Caroline's comment about patients with wet AMD, are you seeing those patients able to get their Xyphovir and VEGF injections on the same day or are those injections typically being staggered? Speaker 400:43:13Hey, Colleen, it's Adam. So yes, we were expecting bilateral treatment to be a core piece of our launch. And then obviously, during the rare episodes of vasculitis last year, we did see that bilateral usage slowed down. We are seeing a return to bilateral usage. We are seeing physicians change their approach in how they administer bilateral. Speaker 400:43:38They'll start potentially with one eye and they'll wait a little bit and see how that progresses and then they'll move to the second eye. So we are seeing bilateral usage increase. I think that's very positive as physicians start to really understand the benefit risk profile of this drug and be able to have those conversations with patients. Anything Caroline you want to add on bilateral? Speaker 100:44:01I think it's very common to have patients have treatment with an anti VEGF in one eye and if they need treatment with different products, including Cytovery in the other eye to do that on the same day. But there's no generalizable formula to how retina doctors work. I will say one thing that retina doctors really like is flexibility. And fortunately, we have that in our label with this very flexible treatment interval between our label. So it can really be tapered to what works for your patient. Speaker 1100:44:39Great. Thanks for taking our questions. Speaker 400:44:41Thank you, Cody. Operator00:44:42One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Phil Nadeau with TD Cowen. Your line is open. Speaker 1200:44:54Good morning. Thanks for taking our questions. A couple on the U. S. Market. Speaker 1200:44:59First, over the summer, right after the Vascolytes events were first found, I think you did a physician survey where you showed about 1 third of physicians had stopped using Cifovirae, 1 third stopped using new patients, but continued patients and then one third there was no change. Do you have a sense of how those numbers stand today? What proportion of physicians are still not using cytovery versus what proportion have returned they're used to normal? That's the first question. And then the second question, a follow-up to Yigal's. Speaker 1200:45:28On the 90% share, what do you attribute that to? Is it the 2 year data that you have versus the 2 year data that IsoRay's presented or is it execution issues? What do you think is enabling the 90% share that you currently have? Thanks. Speaker 400:45:48Hey, Phil, it's Adam. Thanks for the question. So yes, we haven't done any new research since the last wave of the what I call the 3rd, a third, a third. One thing we have seen anecdotally is that each of those segments have started to use, cyfobri again. So the segment that has stopped, we really spent time with those physicians. Speaker 400:46:09We were there. We were being incredibly transparent about these rare cases of vasculitis and we waited. And once those physicians were ready, we then step back up. And so we started to see physicians that had stopped restart. Same for the segment of new patients only, again, we've had a couple of physicians that I know of anecdotally that have said, no, I've started new patients again based on the benefit risk profile of the drug. Speaker 400:46:39And we continue to see growth in those accounts that did not stop. They continue to see the benefit of this drug. So whilst we don't have haven't done that wave of market research again, I do believe we're really impacting those 3 segments. Now the second part of your question, the 90% is, I think it's down to a lot of things, right? Continued strong execution from the team, particularly over the last few months. Speaker 400:47:08We've been incredibly transparent with the and I think we spent a lot of time building trust and confidence. Physicians now I believe truly see the benefits of our overall clinical profile. So this is long term efficacy from Gale, real world safety in over 200,000 doses since launch. Dosing flexibility, the vast majority of physicians, as I said before, are leaning towards 6 to 8 weeks. We have strong payer coverage with our J code from October 1. Speaker 400:47:37I think it's all of those things coming together, but the efficacy profile of this drug, I think stands up high. And this is a drug you choose for its efficacy, the impact it can have on patients' vision moving forward. So we are laser focused on communicating our benefit risk and the benefit of this drug with physicians. And I think that will make a difference. Caroline, anything you want to add? Speaker 100:48:03I think it's like just to hone a little more on the efficacy story, the fact that we have the data from Gale with up to 3 years of data now that's, they really appreciate that this data is so thoughtful and also includes visual function with up to 42% reduction in GA lesion growth. That's something that's amazing. And the fact that every other month dosing into Gail in non subfoldial patients is so meaningful. So the first thing for physicians is the efficacy story, the experience with the company and then their experience using the product. And that's sort of where doctors are getting that experience now. Speaker 100:48:46The initial patients who came in were with physicians who are in our clinical study, which was so large, and now we're reaching all the other physicians in the community. Speaker 1200:48:57That's very helpful. Thank you. Operator00:49:08Our next question comes from Rakesh Chirauri with Jefferies. Your line is open. Speaker 1100:49:13Hi, good morning. Speaker 300:49:14This is Ivy on for Rakesh. Thanks for taking our questions. We just have 2 quick ones on Safari. So when we spoke to our team heading in the train, you had felt confident that the long term split between Safaree and Iserway could be somewhere around like 70 30. So given competitor has commented on their call that either way is currently taking 20% market share after 5 months of launch, How do you feel comfortable that you can maintain this seventythirty split in the long term? Speaker 300:49:43And then secondly, just quickly, why haven't you guided to cephalorimps for 24? And do you plan to guide in later quarters? Thanks. Speaker 600:49:54Thank you so much for that question. Adam, you want to take that? Speaker 400:49:57Hi, Ivy. It's Adam. So yes, as Celestin said, they have a 20% market share. But as I discussed previously, there are multiple ways you can estimate market share. Our assumption is that Astellas is using total vials shipped for a specific time period, so their last quarter versus our last quarter. Speaker 400:50:16What we do is we use real world ECP injection data, which is a snapshot of the current market where physicians are ordering vials and using vials. And we think this is actually a better way of analyzing market share. It actually counts injections rather than looking at vials shipped or revenue. And obviously, there's a total market analysis that we would do. So we're confident that we are the number one GA drug out there. Speaker 400:50:46We also did a time adjusted analysis of our launch versus the competitors' launch. And if you time adjust that you assume they both launch on the same day, ECP or physician demand for XIFAVI was 3 times greater than that of Isova in the 1st 4 months of launch. So that's an incredibly positive metric. We also see that the majority of new patient starts continue to be on Cytovary. And just another point, right, Keep in mind that this market is much larger than we believed from 1,000,000 patients to 1.5. Speaker 400:51:21I think it can accommodate more than one product, but we truly believe that we are the number one product and we expect to maintain that leadership over time. So hopefully that answers your question, Ivy. I'll hand to Tim for the next call. Speaker 500:51:34I'll take the guidance question. So obviously after the past year, we felt we needed a little more time before we could guide effectively. And case in point, we've never been through a Q1 where we have recertifications or the like. So we're just going to take our time and make sure we understand the dynamics over the course of a full year and we'll get back to you on when we plan to guide. Thanks. Operator00:52:01One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Ellie Merle with UBS. Your line is open. Speaker 1300:52:14Hi, guys. Thanks for taking the question and congrats on all the progress. I just want to follow-up on the quarter over quarter growth question asked earlier. You said you're seeing January February as 2 Speaker 100:52:24of the strongest months since launch Speaker 1300:52:26and the sampling rate did not increase. So shouldn't 1Q be higher than 4Q? I guess how do we balance that with the seasonality commentary? I just want to clarify on that point. And then just a second question. Speaker 1300:52:38In terms of compliance and dosing frequency, are you seeing any trends in differences in compliance or dosing frequency at different types of sites such as private equity owned versus academic? Thanks. Speaker 400:52:51Hi, Eddie, it's Adam. So, yes, so we've been seasonality does impact drugs within this market. As I said, I used the analogs that we found from the anti VEGF. We did see recertifications happen a lot in January and leak into February and impacted on the weather. We do believe that January February are likely to be 2 of our largest months. Speaker 400:53:18So we're executing flawlessly and pushing to make Q1 as big as it possibly can be by being incredibly thoughtful in how we interact with these physicians. So the team is flawlessly executing. I'm incredibly proud of them and we're pushing incredibly hard. As you would expect us to, we believe we have the number one GA drug moving forward. Compliance, as I said, it's a touch early for compliance. Speaker 400:53:46We tend to see the vast majority of patients being 6 to 8 weeks and they seem to be very comfortable with that. We have not noticed any difference that I'm aware of between compliance at PE backed practices versus non PE backed practices. We have a nice wide range of business rights. PE backed practices are about 30% of our business and the rest, the remaining 70% are independent practices and academic practices. To my knowledge, we haven't seen any differences in terms of compliance from those groups. Speaker 400:54:21As I said, we've just exited the 1st year. I think as we get into years 2 and 3 of treatment with this drug, that's when physicians will have to have a conversation with their patients back in clients, but it's too early for now. Speaker 100:54:36Great. Thanks. Operator00:54:39One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Francois Brisebois with Oppenheimer. Your line is open. Speaker 800:54:53Hi, this is Dan Tangone on for Frank Riese. Thanks for taking our questions. Related to a question regarding the physician segments from the market research. Now with the permanent J code effective and the gale extension readout, are you starting to see an impact within that 1 third segment of physicians who are on the sidelines? Speaker 400:55:15Yes. Thanks for the question. So yes, obviously, we haven't redone that market research, but we are starting to see an impact from physicians who are on the sideline. The J code unlocked all of that. We continue, it's my favorite metric. Speaker 400:55:29We continue to see double digit new accounts sign up to use SYFOVRI every week since launch. That has continued. That tells you that these physicians are no longer on the sidelines that keep starting to want to start patients. I think that's an incredibly positive metric for us. So yes, whilst we haven't done the research anecdotally, we're hearing that those physicians who are on the sidelines have started to go. Speaker 400:55:54We do have some upside opportunity too, right? So we have about 1800 sites of care across the U. S. That's about 50% of our potential target list. So there's still an opportunity for growth for us to target that other half of the market. Speaker 400:56:12And we have some good plans to go and execute that, which we started in the Q1 and expect to move into the for the rest of the year. So hopefully that answers your question. Speaker 800:56:23Understood. Congrats on the quarter. Speaker 400:56:27Thank you. Thank you. Operator00:56:28One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Joseph Springer with Needham. Your line is open. Speaker 1200:56:46Hi, good morning and thanks for taking our question. Just a quick one on potential switching dynamics. Just curious if you could provide any metrics or data or even qualitative feedback that you're hearing so far on any switching dynamics between XIFABI and ISA rate? Speaker 600:57:07Yes. I think thank you so much, Zoe. Great to hear you. Look, that is a place where I think we are very well positioned as well. At the end of the day, where the metrics will stand out is the comparator between on efficacy as well as on safety, right? Speaker 600:57:23So and on the efficacy, quite frankly, the difference is quite stark, right? I mean, as mentioned before on extra foveal patients up to 42% slowdown versus what has so far been reported as 14%, even though we don't know what it is exactly in the 2nd year for our competing product. And then maybe briefly on the safety, right, that risk that exists on the first injection of developing vasculitis, which is very rare, is something that we now firmly believe is caused by a pre existing allergy towards polyethylene glycol, something that is shared between the products. And we have every reason to expect that both products in the future will have that risk, rare risk associated with it that will then have to be discussed with the patients when a treatment is planned. Speaker 200:58:12Adam, do you want to add something to that? Speaker 400:58:13Yes. Hey, Joey, it's Adam. So yes, no surprise, right? During the rare cases of vasculitis last year, we did see some accounts switch. They switched primarily for safety. Speaker 400:58:26And we know where those accounts are. Now again anecdotally, I have actually seen some physicians switch patients back. So I have seen and heard from my field teams that physicians switched from cyfovary to the competitor and then some of those patients were switched back. So switching does happen in this market. It definitely happened during the rare cases of vasculitis. Speaker 400:58:52But we believe in the profile, the efficacy and the safety and the benefit risk of this drug. And we truly will be focused on making sure we communicate that profile to every physician in this market. Speaker 1200:59:06Great. Thanks so much for the color. Operator00:59:09One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Derek Archila with Wells Fargo. Your line is open. Speaker 1400:59:22Hey, good morning and thanks for taking the questions. Just 2 on Empella. I guess first, have you seen any impact from the launch of Ithacopan in PNH? And I guess how much upside do you think there is in the first line setting from the 10% you discussed today? And then just overall commercial strategy for Empebelli and C3G and MPGM? Speaker 1400:59:42Thanks. Speaker 600:59:44Thank you so much, Derek. Great to hear you. Look, in P and H, we now have a very competitive situation, of course. And our expectations should be commensurate with that competitive situation. So while we don't guide, certainly there will be pressure from this oral product. Speaker 601:00:02I think in general though that it is a great thing that there are now 2 products available to address the problem of extravascular hemolysis in these patients. If we go back a couple of years, as you may recall, because you are already covering us, there was a notion that this was something affecting 7% of patients. That is not true. This is something that affects the overwhelming majority of these patients. And a big segment of patients can and will benefit from this. Speaker 601:00:29And in that sense, raising the awareness around that, having Novartis by our side will be helpful. As we've mentioned before, we're incredibly excited about what we can do in the kidney to the readout of the VALUENT trial this summer and what we will be able to do for the 5,000 patients with T3 gs and ICMP Gen that are in need. Adam, do you want to add something to Speaker 201:00:53Yes. Speaker 401:00:53You said it really well, Cedric, but just to add a few extra bits, right? So Derek, twice a day oral will be appealing to PNH patients for sure. We should expect that. In fact, we've seen 1 or 2 patients switch from Empivalli to the twice a day oral, as you would expect. The vast majority of our patients are really committed to Empivli. Speaker 401:01:17They see the benefits of the efficacy. They see the benefits of the safety profile. And with the auto injector, the Empella injector, we're really improving that convenience aspect of the drug. So we're going to be strongly competitive in the market, but an oral will have an impact. You asked about the first line segment, right? Speaker 401:01:37So I do expect we have 10%. I do expect that the oral will be used nicely within that first line segment. But I've been around the blocker a little bit and every time there's a new entrant into the market and a conversation is had between a physician and a patient, it's a opportunity for Empelli. So if a patient has a conversation with a physician about starting on an oral or switching from Ultomiris or Soliris to an oral, that is an opportunity for us to make sure that Emperevali was in that consideration set. So switching opportunities become particularly important for us during this phase. Speaker 401:02:15And just an execution perspective on nephrology, so we obviously have a great medical affairs, Empella team. We're starting to send that medical affairs team to the nephrology conferences. And that will be the face of the nephrology discussions that we have based on these conferences etcetera until we see some data mid-twenty 24. Speaker 1401:02:40Got it. Thank you. Operator01:02:43One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Douglas Tsao with A. C. Wainwright. Your line is open. Speaker 801:02:56Hi, good morning. Thanks for taking the questions. Just maybe as a follow-up on bilateral treatments. Presumably, there was a slowdown during the vasculitis days. So should we think that relative to your sort of original expectations in terms of how big a part of the business it was, it is smaller? Speaker 801:03:19And are we starting to see sort of some of that catch up? And so should we think about that as sort of some amount of pent up demand of patients who are on-site ovary, but only getting one eye treated, but eventually should most likely convert to bilateral treatment? Thank you. Speaker 101:03:36I think that it's likely that physicians will once they are comfortable and patients have gotten past the first injection or so, then they will be using bilateral for patients just out of convenience for these patients to only have to come in once. So now that we have such a large number of vials that have been used and this robust patient experience to date, I think that we're approaching that. Speaker 401:04:07Yes. Doug, it's Adam. Just to add, I think the bilateral usage was definitely impacted as you said. I expect that to come back, but it's going to be time delayed, right? As we start to communicate with all of these physicians, they've changed their practice on how they do bilateral injections, how the process of how they do it is different based on what happened last year. Speaker 401:04:31I don't think it impacts the opportunity. I think that's just the time delay as physicians get Speaker 201:04:36more comfortable. Speaker 801:04:37No. And I think my sort of question was, is it when we think about a certain number of patients on-site for OTTR today, presumably a higher proportion are just having a single eye treated than you might have originally anticipated, but we should expect those to eventually catch up. So on a like we should see vials per patient increase relative to where we are? Speaker 401:05:02I think you should expect to see bilateral increase, yes, moving forward. Speaker 801:05:07Okay, great. Thank you. Operator01:05:10One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Garik Sivanavey with Mizuho Securities. Speaker 501:05:24Hey, good morning. Thank you for taking my questions and congratulations on the quarter. Just 2 please. 1, I might have missed this before, but just on the European reexamination process, could you just clarify for me whether as a company during this reexamination period, whether you are able to submit additional data or new analyses? Or is it that the 2 new repertoires provide just a fresh view of the previous data that was included in the original dossier? Speaker 501:05:58So that's my first question. And then my second question, please, just a reminder on the safety profile of Cybovary. Has the rate of vasculitis changed in terms of either increasing or potentially decreasing? Or is it essentially the same? Thank you. Speaker 601:06:16Thank you so much. Great to hear you. First of all, on the European Union, so you are not allowed to include new data, but you are allowed to include new analyses, right? So that is something that we that our team has really done well. And again, especially the microprimatory data is really compelling. Speaker 601:06:36So we'll see what's going to happen. As we mentioned in our field battle, but one that we are excited to take on. Then as it relates to the safety, the rate continues to be at 0.01%, where it has been since July. And of course, that stability provides very good context for physicians to disclose to their patients when they speak with them as to what the risk in front of them is versus the benefit that they can get from being untreated. So unchanged, again, these cases are so rare that for a rate change to become manifest, we're going to have to wait quite a bit. Operator01:07:11Thank you. And I'm not showing any further questions at this time. I'd like to turn the call back over to Cedric for any closing remarks. Speaker 601:07:20Thank you so much everyone for joining. It is a great start to the year for us, and we look forward to sharing much more with all of you as the months come by. And for those of you available later today, we will be here to take questions and answer any further inquiries that you may have. Thank you. Operator01:07:38Ladies and gentlemen, this does conclude today's presentation. You may now disconnect and have a wonderful day.Read morePowered by Conference Call Audio Live Call not available Earnings Conference CallApellis Pharmaceuticals Q4 202300:00 / 00:00Speed:1x1.25x1.5x2x Earnings DocumentsSlide DeckPress Release(8-K)Annual report(10-K) Apellis Pharmaceuticals Earnings HeadlinesTanfield reports Snorkel's sales dip and EBITDA lossFebruary 7, 2025 | msn.comTanfield brothers in race against clock to form new UCI Continental teamDecember 2, 2024 | msn.comThe Trump Dump is starting; Get out of stocks now?The first 365 days of the Trump presidency… Will be the best time to get rich in American history.April 21, 2025 | Paradigm Press (Ad)ETNI Entest Group, Inc.October 29, 2024 | seekingalpha.comNBRNF N Brown Group plcOctober 26, 2024 | seekingalpha.comBradley Walsh halts The Chase as he issues emotional message to viewersOctober 26, 2024 | msn.comSee More Tanfield Group Headlines Get Earnings Announcements in your inboxWant to stay updated on the latest earnings announcements and upcoming reports for companies like Apellis Pharmaceuticals? Sign up for Earnings360's daily newsletter to receive timely earnings updates on Apellis Pharmaceuticals and other key companies, straight to your email. Email Address About Apellis PharmaceuticalsApellis Pharmaceuticals (NASDAQ:APLS), a commercial-stage biopharmaceutical company, focuses on the discovery, development, and commercialization of therapeutic compounds through the inhibition of the complement system for autoimmune and inflammatory diseases. It offers EMPAVELI for the treatment of paroxysmal nocturnal hemoglobinuria, C3 glomerulopathy and immune complex membranoproliferative glomerulonephritis, and hematopoietic stem cell transplantation-associated thrombotic microangiopathy; and SYFOVRE for treating geographic atrophy secondary to age-related macular degeneration and geographic atrophy (GA). The company also develops APL-3007, a small interfering RNA, or siRNA, which is in a Phase 1 clinical trial, as well as an oral complement inhibitor that is in preclinical development. It has a collaboration and license agreement with Swedish Orphan Biovitrum AB (publ) for development and commercialization of pegcetacoplan; and a collaboration with Beam Therapeutics Inc. focused on the use of Beam's base editing technology to discover new treatments for complement-driven diseases. The company was incorporated in 2009 and is based in Waltham, Massachusetts.View Apellis Pharmaceuticals ProfileRead more More Earnings Resources from MarketBeat Earnings Tools Today's Earnings Tomorrow's Earnings Next Week's Earnings Upcoming Earnings Calls Earnings Newsletter Earnings Call Transcripts Earnings Beats & Misses Corporate Guidance Earnings Screener Earnings By Country U.S. Earnings Reports Canadian Earnings Reports U.K. Earnings Reports Latest Articles Archer Aviation Unveils NYC Network Ahead of Key Earnings Report3 Reasons to Like the Look of Amazon Ahead of EarningsTesla Stock Eyes Breakout With Earnings on DeckJohnson & Johnson Earnings Were More Good Than Bad—Time to Buy? 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There are 15 speakers on the call. Operator00:00:00Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you for standing by, and welcome to the Apellis Pharmaceuticals 4th Quarter 2023 Earnings Conference Call. At this time, all participants are in a listen only mode. After the speakers' presentation, there will be a question and answer Please be advised today's conference is being recorded. I would now hand the conference over to your speaker host, Meredith Keiser, Senior Vice President, Investor Relations and Strategic Finance. Operator00:00:28Please go ahead. Speaker 100:00:32Good morning, and thank you for joining us to discuss Apellas' Q4 and full year 2023 financial results. With me on the call are Co Founder and Chief Executive Officer, Doctor. Cedric Francois Chief Operating Officer, Adam Townsend Chief Medical Officer, Doctor. Caroline Bommel and Chief Financial Officer, Tim Sullivan. Before we begin, let me point out that we will be making forward looking statements that are based on our current expectations and beliefs. Speaker 100:00:58These statements are subject to certain risks and uncertainties and actual results may differ materially. I encourage you to consult the risk factors discussed in our SEC filings for additional detail. Now, I'll turn the call over to Cedric. Speaker 200:01:10Thank you, Meredith, and thank you all for joining us this morning. As I reflect on this past year, I am extremely proud of our team and all of our achievements in 2023. Our 2 commercial products SYFOVRI and Empaverin are making meaningful differences for patients. The year ended with SYFOVRI in a very strong position and we remain encouraged by the continuous uptake and high compliance rates for empathetic and PNH. We also had multiple positive data readouts including up to 3 years of efficacy and safety data from both of our approved therapies. Speaker 200:01:49While 2023 certainly had its challenges, our accomplishments and our resilience position us well for continued execution in 2024 and to deliver on our mission for patients now and in the future. Let me share some details on this past year and our priorities for 2024. Beginning with SYFOPRI. We recently celebrated Xyfobri's 1 year approval anniversary and what a year it has been. The launch has exceeded our expectations even with the unexpected challenges we faced last summer. Speaker 200:02:27More than 200,000 SYFOVRI doses have now been distributed to physician practices since launch through mid February and we estimate that approximately 215,000 Cyfol 3 injections have been administered to patients through mid February, including our Phase III clinical trials. These numbers underscore the retina community's confidence in the benefits of site filgrin and central role it plays in improving patients' lives. And importantly, based on these numbers, the risk of developing retinal vasculitis remains rare at an estimated rate of approximately 0.01% per injection. In the Q4, we reported $114,000,000 to SYFYVI U. S. Speaker 200:03:15Net product revenue. We achieved $275,000,000 in SYFYVI revenues for the full year. While we have experienced modest seasonality in the Q1 so far, SYFYVI continues to show meaningful growth and we look forward to bringing it to more and more patients throughout the year. In 2024, our priorities with Cyflorin are to maximize access to patients in need in the U. S. Speaker 200:03:45And to bring Cyflorin to patients with GA worldwide. Key to these are our commercial and medical activities, including building on the relationships we've already established in the retina community. Given our global expansion goal with CYF4BRI, let me comment on the European Union. As you know, we received a negative opinion by the Committee of Medicinal Products for Human Use or CHMP for the marketing application of SYFOVRI in the EU. While this is disappointing, we remain steadfast in our efforts given the more than 2,500,000 GA patients in need of treatment across Europe. Speaker 200:04:29The feedback and support we have received for SYKFOR RE from the physician and patient communities in Europe has been extraordinary. We have been informed of several letters sent to EMEA from multiple European retina organizations, highlighting the need for new treatments and how important CyPharmacy will be for patients. As such, we are initiating a reexamination of our application, which includes revising our dossier to ensure that key questions are addressed. We expect a final opinion in connection with this reexamination to be issued at an upcoming CHMP meeting in the Q2. If positive, a decision by the European Commission is anticipated in the Q3. Speaker 200:05:16To be clear, and as we've said many times before, this is not going to be easy. It will be an uphill battle and we do not know the likelihood of success at this stage, but we strongly believe in our data, including analyses that many experts agreed demonstrate a functional benefit with cytochrome treatment and we will continue to work closely with the CHMP and the retina community throughout the process. Turning to Enviva. We generated $24,000,000 in 4th quarter U. S. Speaker 200:05:48Net product revenue $91,000,000 for the full year. The Epapheri injector, an innovative and first of its kind high-tech volume injector was approved and launched last fall. We've been very pleased with the feedback and adoption so far. And in 2024, we will remain focused on maximizing our market position in PNH and also look forward to the Phase 3 data readouts for systemicxitacopan in C3g and ICMPGN, 2 rare and debilitating kidney diseases. Our Phase 3 value study is fully enrolled and we expect top line data from this study midyear. Speaker 200:06:33Over the past couple of years, we've been very focused on our commercial products and new launches, but we have other exciting earlier stage programs advancing. Let me shift to our 4th priority for 2024, which is to progress our early R and D pipeline with an eye to the long term. In addition to the AbbVie initiatives in C3G and ICMPGN, we are focused on our siRNA program, APL-three thousand and seven, which is now in a Phase 1 dose escalation study with data expected later this year. Additionally, we are advancing the gene editing program with Beam on which we also expect to share more this year. We are entering 2024 from a position of strength with an unwavering commitment to address unmet needs for patients and to create even greater value for our shareholders. Speaker 200:07:31And with that, I will now turn it over to Adam to discuss our commercial and medical affairs activity. Speaker 300:07:38Thank you, Cedric. Speaker 400:07:39It was a big year commercially for Opellis with the launch of SYFOBRI in GA and the commercialization of Emproveli in PNH. Starting with SYFOVRI, in the 4th quarter, we delivered approximately 62,000 doses to physician practices, including 55,000 commercial vials and 6,400 samples, generating $114,000,000 in U. S. Net product revenue. This strong growth underscores the rebound in weekly demand that began in August of 2023. Speaker 400:08:17Our execution was driven by meaningful engagement with our key stakeholders, physicians, patients and payers. We continue to see weekly orders coming from both new and existing physician practices with a double digit number of new sites ordering SYFOGRI every week since launch. Patients are motivated to seek treatment and the vast majority of physicians are treating their patients with Xiphobri every 6 to 8 weeks, reinforcing how much doctors and patients appreciate a more flexible dosing regimen. And we continue to have robust payer coverage. We are encouraged by the demand growth we are seeing in the Q1 so far. Speaker 400:09:04January February have been 2 of our biggest months since launch. However, as expected, we did see some seasonality in January as a result of Medicare recertifications as well as weather delays affecting doctor visits and product shipments. These seasonality trends are consistent with what has been seen with some of the anti VEGF products in the wet AMD market. Today, SYFOVRI is the number one chosen GA treatment with the current market share of approximately 90%. At launch, we estimated that there were 1,000,000 patients with GA in the U. Speaker 400:09:44S. Now that treatments are available for GA patients, we are learning that this population may be even bigger than we expected with estimates suggesting there may be up to 1,500,000 patients. Going forward, we expect to continue to build this market and maintain our market leading position. We will be laser focused on executing our strategy, highlighting the key advantages of SYFOPRI, which include increasing effects over time with more than 40% reductions in GA lesion growth demonstrated in our GALE extension study, Extensive experience with approximately 215,000 injections estimated to have been administered between our clinical trials and real world experience. And more vision saved for patients, meaning treatment with Xiphobri has been shown to preserve visual function longer in multiple post hoc analyses. Speaker 400:10:49Now to Epivale. The positive trends witnessed across the key leading indicators for this patient population have continued through the end of 2023. In the Q4, Empaveli generated approximately $24,000,000 in U. S. Net product sales, resulting in a total of $91,000,000 for the full year. Speaker 400:11:12Notably, approximately 10% of demand in 2023 was from treatment naive patients and compliance rates remain incredibly high at 97%. We also continue to have a very strong safety profile. We have over 1400 patient years of systemic pegcetagopalan exposure and have had 0 cases of meningococcal infection and very low rates of thrombosis. We are facing a more competitive market with the recent approval of an oral product in PNH. And I expect the convenience of a twice a day pill will be appealing to some patients. Speaker 400:11:56I previously commented on the positive feedback since approval of the Empivendi injector. By simplifying administration and offering greater mobility, we believe the injector elevates the patient experience and fortifies our competitive position. Before I hand it over to Caroline, I'll close by saying that I am incredibly proud of both the SYFOVRI and Empivalli medical and commercial teams. They did an outstanding job throughout 2023, working night and day to bring these two medicines to physicians and patients in need. With that, let me turn the call over to Caroline. Speaker 100:12:36Thanks, Adam, and good morning, everyone. We had an active year within the medical community for both SYFOVRI and Empivelli. In November, we presented data from our GALE extension study, which followed 3 years of continuous treatment with SYFOBRI at the American Academy of Ophthalmology Annual Meeting. These data continue to show increasing effects over time with both monthly and every other month Xfobri dosing, a seminal feature of SYFOVRI's efficacy profile. As Adam just highlighted, SYFOVRI reduced GA lesion growth by more than 40% in patients with non subfovial GA lesions in year 3 compared to projected sham. Speaker 100:13:22This is the largest treatment effect shown in GA to date. 2024 has already been a busy year so far in terms of medical meetings. Most recently, we were at the Macular Society, where we had a significant presence with 3 oral data presentations, including our Gale 36 month data, a matching adjusted indirect comparison or MAIC analysis using our 24 month data and post hoc microperometry analysis demonstrating preservation of function in the retina following treatment with XIFAVIRI. Turning to empovelli. We, along with our partner Sobe, presented post hoc long term efficacy and safety data on empovelli@ashannualmeetingindecember. Speaker 100:14:15These data showed that treatment with empovelli can help PNH patients achieve rapid and sustained control of their disease over the long term. Furthermore, it is impressive that the majority of patients remain transfusion free for up to 3 years, alleviating a significant and common disease burden for many patients living with PNH. Additionally, at Kidney Week, we had the opportunity to present new data from our Phase 2 NOLBEL study, investigating pegzetacoplin for the treatment of post transplant recurrence of C3g and ICMPGN. C3g and ICMPGN are diseases in which patients have a 50% chance of progressing to end stage renal disease or kidney transplantation over the course of 5 to 10 years. Between these two indications, there are approximately 5,000 potential patients in the U. Speaker 100:15:19S. And up to 8,000 in Europe with no approved treatments available. This year, we are looking forward to the top line data from our Phase 3 VALYANT study, which we expect mid year. VALIENT enrolled 124 patients, split fifty-fifty between treatment and placebo, aged 12 and up with C3g or primary ICMPGN. It is the only study to include both native kidney patients and patients who have recurrent disease after receiving a kidney transplant. Speaker 100:15:58Study participants were randomized to receive pegzetacoplin or placebo twice weekly for 26 weeks. Following this 26 week randomized controlled period, patients will proceed to a 26 week open label phase in which all patients receive pegzidicopalan. The primary endpoint of the study is the reduction from baseline in urine protein to creatinine ratio or UPCR as compared to placebo at week 26. I'd like to shift gears and comment on the Cascades Phase 3 study evaluating the efficacy and safety of pegcetacoplin in patients with cold agglutinin disease or CAD. As Sobe previously disclosed, the decision was made to end the study due to decreased medical need in the CAD space and a limited number of patients eligible for the study. Speaker 100:16:55This is not due to any safety concerns and the efficacy has not been evaluated due to the study being masked. I'd like to express our gratitude to the CAG community for their support and collaboration. Sobeys working with study investigators to manage the next steps for those enrolled in the study with their welfare as the priority. Now, I will turn the call over to Tim for a review of the financials. Tim? Speaker 400:17:25Thank you, Caroline. Speaker 500:17:27I will provide a brief overview of our financials and Speaker 600:17:30you can find additional details in the Speaker 500:17:31press release that we issued earlier this morning. Total revenue for the Q4 and full year 2023 was $146,000,000 $397,000,000 respectively. Quarterly revenue consisted of $114,000,000 in site full rate and $24,000,000 in Empa Valley U. S. Net product revenue and $8,000,000 in additional licensing and other revenue associated with the Sobeys collaboration. Speaker 500:17:56Full year revenue consists of $275,000,000 in SYBOVRI and $91,000,000 in Emflivelli U. S. Net product revenue and $30,000,000 in additional licensing and other revenue associated with Sobeys collaboration. Turning to the rest of the P and L. For the Q4 and full year, cost of sales was $20,000,000 $58,500,000 respectively. Speaker 500:18:19R and D expenses were $69,000,000 $354,000,000 respectively. G and A expenses were $142,000,000 $501,000,000 respectively, and we reported a net loss of $89,000,000 $529,000,000 respectively. I'd like to point out a few items in our financial statements that will help in evaluating our business. First, we recorded accounts receivable of $206,000,000 at year end, which is primarily associated with payment terms that we provide to the SYPO REIT distributors. The accounts receivable line item has increased along with the increasing SYFOVRI sales and is in line with typical payment terms. Speaker 500:19:012nd, as we shared previously, we are now categorizing the majority of medical affairs and certain other costs in G and A instead of in R and D. This represents an approximately $22,000,000 shift from R and Speaker 200:19:12D to G and A in Speaker 500:19:14the Q4 $41,000,000 in the second half of twenty twenty three. No reclassifications were necessary for prior periods. However, it is important to note this shift when reviewing trends in our operating expenses. And finally, our operating expenses do not yet reflect the ongoing efficiencies that we expect from our restructuring last August due to severance and winding down of certain projects. As I said last quarter, we expect to realize these efficiencies beginning in 2024. Speaker 500:19:43And while I'm not going to get into detailed numbers, what I will say is that we expect our total operating expenses in 2024 to be less than our total expenses in 2023. Turning to our balance sheet. As of December 31, 2023, we had $351,000,000 in cash and cash equivalents. We continuously evaluate ways in which to further strengthen our financial position. And with that in mind, today we announced that we entered into agreements to unwind approximately 80% of the capped call associated with the $425,000,000 in convertible notes that we hold in treasury. Speaker 500:20:19We expect total aggregate net cash proceeds to be up to $125,000,000 including approximately 100,000,000 dollars following this transaction and up to $25,000,000 in additional net cash proceeds if we unwind the remaining capital. The unwinding transactions will be settled based on a 7 day averaging period beginning on and including February 27, 2024. As of December 31, 2023, the aggregate principal balance of the remaining convertible notes net of unamortized issuance costs was $93,000,000 We now believe that our cash and cash equivalents combined with the cash generated from the cash called unwind and from sales of SEDOVERE and EMBOVELE will be sufficient to fund our projected operating expenses and capital expenditures for the foreseeable future. That said, we will continue to evaluate opportunities to further optimize our balance sheet and maintain an appropriate cash balance at all times. We have multiple levers that are available to us and as always, we will be incredibly thoughtful and opportunistic in any decision we make. Speaker 500:21:27I will now hand the call back over to Cedric for closing remarks. Cedric? Speaker 200:21:32Thanks, Tim. This was a strong finish to the year. We are building on our success and learnings and the evidence of our ongoing strength continues to be seen in the numbers and feedback we are seeing. We are headed into the year with renewed energy and an acute focus in our goal of putting patients first and elevating the standard of care in all disease areas in which we work. With this, we are determined to execute on our 4 key priorities, continuing to expand patient access to SYFOVRI in the U. Speaker 200:22:04S, while also working to bring the therapy worldwide Maximizing Empavity in PNH and then expanding in this new indication in C3g and ICMPGN. And finally, progressing our early pipeline including the siRNA program and our collaboration with Beam. As always, we are looking forward to sharing updates as they become available and continuing our efforts towards becoming the global leader in complement medicine. Let us now open the call for questions. Operator? Operator00:22:37Thank Our first question comes from John Miller with Evercore. Your line is open. Speaker 700:23:01Hey guys, thanks for taking the question. Congrats again on a great Q4 and a great reacceleration of the launch. I would love to start on the EU reexamination. Centric, you mentioned that you're getting a lot of enthusiasm from patient groups from docs in the EU. I would love to get a sense from you for how much impact that doc enthusiasm will have on the reexamination and maybe why that wasn't helpful in the first round? Speaker 700:23:31What's changed now that wasn't the truth in the first examination? And then secondly on the commercial launch, if even accounting for seasonality and is it fair to expect that Q1 will still be growing robustly relative to Q4? Do you expect that March orders will be making up for Medicare recertification delays in January, February? Speaker 600:23:58Thank you so much, John. So first of all, as it relates to the European Union, so these are these letters are letters that are not sent to us. They are sent to independently from us to the review organization and then we receive them via that route. So these are important letters of support. I think they highlight the unmet medical need. Speaker 600:24:21They highlight the support that physicians have for this product and their desire to make it available to their patients in Europe. Will it have an impact? That is really impossible to tell for us. As we've always mentioned, this will be an uphill battle. It is rare for these appeals to be successful. Speaker 600:24:38But of course, having the support from the patients and the physicians is important. Then as it relates to the commercial question, I will hand that over to Adam. Speaker 400:24:46Yes. Hey, John, it's Adam. So yes, we did see seasonality impact January and the start of February. So that the vast majority of that was due to recertifications and we also had a few weather delays. So interestingly, right, we did some homework and the seasonality is always consistent and we saw it with in our homework with some of the anti VEGF products over the years. Speaker 400:25:11For example, I mean, we believe that EYLEA has not seen growth above 5% in Q1 versus Q4 over approximately the last 10 years, with several years resulting in a quarter on quarter decline in Q1. Tends to be due to recertification seasonality and weather, etcetera, other demands. We have seen 2 of our biggest months since launch in January February. And your question was, do you expect to see that continue in March? We think we're through all of the recertifications. Speaker 400:25:41Hopefully, the weather stays friendly to us. So we continue to expect to see solid numbers in March as we move forward. Speaker 700:25:53Makes sense. And maybe one for Tim, or I'll get back in Speaker 500:25:56the queue while I'm at the play. Speaker 600:26:00Go ahead, John. Why don't you ask it quickly? I think that's easier. Speaker 800:26:04I was just going to Speaker 700:26:05ask him about the runway now through the foreseeable future. I remember at JPMorgan, you were saying that it was plausible you could reach profitability and be funded through the foreseeable future, but that you might not want to do that. And I would just want to get a sense for how that's changed since JPMorgan and whether you're really actively looking for ways to bolster cash position and give yourself a little bit more flexibility or if you think you've done that with these cap calls? Speaker 500:26:36Well, so thanks, John. So the good news is with the capped call with $100,000,000 $120,000,000 to $125,000,000 essentially non dilutive capital in addition to the $351,000,000 we reported at year end. That puts us in a great financial position. And as we mentioned, in our scenarios that we project that should get us to through without having to raise capital necessarily. I mean, it could be technically done. Speaker 500:27:04But we also have certain things like our SFJ liability, which that's $200,000,000 in cash out the door over the next 2 years. That could put us in a position where we don't really have an ideal cash balance. So the good news is we're in a pretty strong position and we have a lot of options available to us to opportunistically make sure we have a sufficient cash balance that could be refinancing SFJ, that could be a number of things. So again, we'll be thoughtful and opportunistic as we always have been and that pretty much covers it. Speaker 700:27:42Fair enough. Thanks so much. Speaker 200:27:44Thanks. Thank you, Jim. Operator00:27:46One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Tazeen Ahmad with BFA Securities. Your line is open. Speaker 100:28:01Just a point of clarification, Adam. Are you expecting to see growth in 1Q relative to 4Q on sales? I just want to clarify, you didn't mention the EYLEA historic and wanted to make sure it's not flat to down. And then secondly, I have a question on 3,007. What are you expecting to show for this siRNA program and what potential indications do you think it has promise in? Speaker 100:28:29Thanks. Speaker 400:28:32Hey, Celine, it's Adam. So yes, I mean, we continue to see growth in February and we expect to continue to see growth in March moving forward. As I said, January February were 2 of our biggest months since launch. You also asked about samples. So we continue to provide samples to our U. Speaker 400:28:50S. Physicians and we expect to continue to do that, especially Speaker 200:28:54as we're still in what Speaker 400:28:55I would call the early phases of this launch. Interestingly, we didn't see sampling increase in the Q1, which I'll be honest, I thought it probably would as we were going through the recertifications. But sampling will continue to be there as we move forward. So hopefully that answers your first question. And I'll hand over to Cedric. Speaker 600:29:16Thank you, Adam. So, Tasim, on 3,007, so this is in the escalation phase in healthy subject. It is the first of several things that are coming out of the preclinical realm now, things that we're very excited about. I will talk about more in the years to come as well. So what we're hoping to see there in the healthy volunteer phase is, of course, how much we can knock down C3 and how durable that will be in these subjects. Speaker 600:29:43The indications that we are going to pursue, we are for now keeping confidential, But we of course have a what we believe is a very exciting development plan in store for that product. Operator00:29:59Thank you. One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Anupam Rama with JPMorgan. Your line is open. Speaker 400:30:12Hey, guys. Thanks so much for taking Speaker 500:30:14the question. Adam, I wanted to ask you a quick question. What is driving your commentary about the GA population size here in the U. S. Being closer to 1,500,000 versus I think what you've previously talked about is about 1,000,000 patients? Speaker 500:30:29Thanks so Speaker 400:30:30much. Yes. Thanks, Adam. Pam, so I'll answer and then I'll hand to Caroline as well if she has any comments. So one thing we found with our interactions with physicians is, one of our work prior to launch was sizing an opportunity that was based on a prevalence data, but also having discussions pre launch with physicians about how many patients that they think they have. Speaker 400:30:52And one thing we found is when you're first to market launch, you'll find a lot of patients that weren't categorized as GA, having GA because there was no treatments were lost to follow-up in terms of sitting with their optometrists or something like that. So we spent a large amount of effort to drive patients to go and get tested and check their vision at their optometrists. And then if they are diagnosed with GA move into the clinic of a retina physician or an injecting physician. So in those interactions, we're starting to find that those patients that potentially were lost to follow-up have now been diagnosed with GI and are moving into the practices. So that's how we believe based on those interactions that the number is the market is bigger than we had first anticipated. Speaker 400:31:36Caroline, do you want to add anything from a doctor perspective? Speaker 100:31:40Sure. Thank you. I think that GA story is getting out there, not only to retina physicians and other eye care specialists, but to patients. And this has really helped to drive it. The other thing is that now we have that we have a treatment, all of the patients that we've been seeing that have neovascular wet AMD in one eye, we're looking more closely at their fellow eye and seeing, I think, that there's GA in those patients that had previously just been observed. Speaker 100:32:12So, the number of patients seems to be greater and continues to be more in my practice. Speaker 500:32:22Thanks so much for taking our question. Operator00:32:25One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Salveen Richter with Goldman Sachs. Your line is open. Speaker 100:32:38Great. Good morning and thank you for taking our question. This is Elizabeth on for Salveen. Two questions from us on the EU reexamination of the application of SYFOVRI. So first, you noted that you had revised rapporteurs have been identified and if there's any color you could provide on them with respect to them providing potentially a new perspective compared to the first set of rapporteurs? Speaker 600:33:17Thank you, Elizabeth. Great to hear you. So in the revision, we don't provide that detail, of course, but what's important is to educate, of course, to understand this disease of geographic atrophy and how that works as it relates to the functional endpoints. We have, as you mentioned, 2 new repertoires now. These are going to provide a very fresh view at what we have presented. Speaker 600:33:42And we have new analyses available. We continue to generate data, as you know, in the GAL extension study as well. So, look, as we've always said, we believe that we have strong evidence, of course, not in a pre specified prospective trial, but based on what we gathered throughout our very large data set. And that is what we will now present to these new repertoires with more focus and by making some concessions maybe on the label, but with a path forward, we hope. Speaker 100:34:17Got it. Understood. Thank you. Operator00:34:20One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Ygal Nochomovitz with Citigroup. Your line is open. Speaker 900:34:34Hi, great. Thanks, Cedric and team. Cedric, I appreciate as you pointed out that it's not going to be easy for the CHMP reexamination. It's an uphill battle. You've mentioned the micropromitry data. Speaker 900:34:45You've shown us the post hoc BCVA data. There's another metric, which maybe you could talk about. I don't think you've discussed it before, the electroretinogram, the ERG. It's a very precise measure of electrical activity in the retina. Have you looked at that? Speaker 900:35:00Do you have any data there? Is that something that you could potentially include in the future that could support the claim that there is a functional benefit even though you don't see it in the imaging or in the post hoc BCBA? Thanks. Speaker 600:35:17Thank you so much, Yigal. So ERG, I will hand it over to Caroline to comment on that next step, is not the type of examination that you could use to look at a functional response in geographic atrophy. Again, there's like a resolution problem with that from what I understand, but Caroline can talk about that more. What I think is important here is that the data that we have on macroprimetry is very strong, right? And it's data that again, the longer you treat patients, the more you see these benefits increase over time. Speaker 600:35:47And that is also reflected in the functional measurements that we have. So we will put all of that together in that package. We will consider on what we can do prospectively. That will take time, of course. But for everybody in the future to continue to study this. Speaker 600:36:04But for now, I think we have a strong package with clear evidence that ERG is definitely not something that is part of that equation. Caroline, I don't know if you want to Speaker 100:36:12Thank you. CRG is something that absolutely is used for clinical studies for inherited retinal diseases. It gives a gross response to function and is less used for something like geographic lab streak. But actually, our microproprietary data gives very similar sort of data to an ERG, but in a more directed fashion. I think the story of the cyfobry is it's looking at the overall picture of what SYFOVRI has to add. Speaker 100:36:45And when we present this, it's very meaningful for doctors at meetings. We talk about the imaging parameters, how SYFOLRI reduces growth of GA, which alone in itself is highly meaningful. We talk about the AI parameters. And then we talk about all the functional data that we have, which is microperometry, time to vision loss, and other parameters that we've given at the clinical meeting. So I think that no one else has the amount of the robust microperometry data that we have in such a large patient group and it really speaks to physicians. Speaker 100:37:21And it's really just presenting the entire Cypropri story to the EMA and really educating the EMA on the story. Speaker 900:37:31Okay. Thank you. Carolyn and Cedric. And then just one for Adam. You mentioned, Adam, the 90% share. Speaker 900:37:38Is that new starts or is that existing or is that everybody? Can you just split that out if possible? Speaker 400:37:46Yes. That's thanks Yigal. Yes, that's the total market share. So we're the number one beating GA drug. Speaker 900:37:55Okay. Thank you very much. Operator00:37:58One moment for our next question. Next question comes from Steve Seedhouse with Raymond James. Your line is open. Speaker 1000:38:11Great. Thanks for taking the question. I wanted to ask about a couple of specific parameters as it pertains to the SYFOVRI launch. First, can you comment on patient persistence or discontinuation rates in the real world? 2nd, just the interval between doses, is it closer to 8 weeks or 6 weeks? Speaker 1000:38:31What's the sort of average dose interval? And then also net price or gross to net adjustment we should be thinking about as well? Thanks. Speaker 600:38:41Thank you, Steve. Maybe Caroline, you can comment on what we've seen with this continuation and then Adam will talk about the pathology and the gross to it. Speaker 100:38:52Overall, from what I hear from physicians and what I've seen is that patients are highly motivated and actually in some ways are very comforted to know the exact number of injections that they might be receiving over a year and the following years. With anti VEGF, it's a we often use treatment extend, so it can be a little more variable. But I think that the majority of physicians in the real world are dosing every 6 to 8 weeks with patients and patients seem to be returning for their follow ups. There was one group that looked at this, a large retina group that found very high levels of clients in the patients. Speaker 400:39:32Yes. Just to build on that too, Steve, it's Adam. We're still in the we just got past the 1st year, so it's still early in the launch and we found that the vast majority of patients are really committed to receiving the treatment as Caroline just described beautifully. So I think to the second part of your question, we are seeing the vast majority being every 6 to 8 weeks. It tends to skew closer to 6 weeks, but that flexibility of every other month's dosing and that range allows physicians to move appointments around particularly when weather impacts etcetera, etcetera. Speaker 400:40:12So we truly believe that the every other month dosing as we call it 6 to 8 weeks is a real competitive advantage for us and that the vast majority of patients are choosing that frequency. I'll hand the gross to net question over Speaker 500:40:27to Tim. Yes. Thanks, Adam. So in terms of gross to net, we don't guide on that. I think our previous guidance something between 10% 20%. Speaker 500:40:37But in our 10 ks, we do have some pretty good disclosure over the past year in terms of blended disclosure, both SYFOVRI and EBITDAVELI, but it has chargebacks, discounts and fees laid out, government and other rebates and returns. And what you can see there is a provision related to sales in the current year that gets you kind of to the midpoint of that. That's on a historical basis. We don't say what that is going forward, but yes, sort of towards the middle. Speaker 1000:41:04Thanks so much. I just have one clarification, because Adam mentioned, I think, sampling you didn't see sampling increase in 1Q so far. I'm just curious, is that relative to 4Q or relative to what? Because in 4Q, it was down I think relative to like it was 6 we just reported 6,400 relative to 10,000 in the prior quarter. So I'm just curious what's the reference to what's the reference point for that comment? Speaker 400:41:31Yes. I was a little surprised. I'll be honest with you. Our assumption going this is the 1st January February we've had right where recertifications were new to us. So our assumption prior to that was that some physicians would reach for a sample during this process. Speaker 400:41:48But I actually think that our sampling rate was relatively flat, did not increase. It did not increase versus Q4 too dramatically. And I think that's because we were relatively efficient in getting through the re verification process. So my assumption on something going up prior to those months turned out to be wrong. So I do expect sampling to continue. Speaker 400:42:14I do expect it to be continue to be flat quarter on quarter. As we drive new accounts to start, they tend to reach for less samples and with our J code, it's very easy for these accounts to get reimbursed for cyfobry. So hopefully that answers your question. Speaker 200:42:33Yes. Thanks so much. Operator00:42:36One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Colleen Cussey with Baird. Your line is Speaker 200:42:46open. Great. Speaker 100:42:48Thanks. Good morning. Speaker 1100:42:49Congrats on the progress. A couple of commercial questions from us. What share of the patients on Cyclo Verde today are receiving bilateral injections versus 1 injection or injection 1 eye? And then following up on Caroline's comment about patients with wet AMD, are you seeing those patients able to get their Xyphovir and VEGF injections on the same day or are those injections typically being staggered? Speaker 400:43:13Hey, Colleen, it's Adam. So yes, we were expecting bilateral treatment to be a core piece of our launch. And then obviously, during the rare episodes of vasculitis last year, we did see that bilateral usage slowed down. We are seeing a return to bilateral usage. We are seeing physicians change their approach in how they administer bilateral. Speaker 400:43:38They'll start potentially with one eye and they'll wait a little bit and see how that progresses and then they'll move to the second eye. So we are seeing bilateral usage increase. I think that's very positive as physicians start to really understand the benefit risk profile of this drug and be able to have those conversations with patients. Anything Caroline you want to add on bilateral? Speaker 100:44:01I think it's very common to have patients have treatment with an anti VEGF in one eye and if they need treatment with different products, including Cytovery in the other eye to do that on the same day. But there's no generalizable formula to how retina doctors work. I will say one thing that retina doctors really like is flexibility. And fortunately, we have that in our label with this very flexible treatment interval between our label. So it can really be tapered to what works for your patient. Speaker 1100:44:39Great. Thanks for taking our questions. Speaker 400:44:41Thank you, Cody. Operator00:44:42One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Phil Nadeau with TD Cowen. Your line is open. Speaker 1200:44:54Good morning. Thanks for taking our questions. A couple on the U. S. Market. Speaker 1200:44:59First, over the summer, right after the Vascolytes events were first found, I think you did a physician survey where you showed about 1 third of physicians had stopped using Cifovirae, 1 third stopped using new patients, but continued patients and then one third there was no change. Do you have a sense of how those numbers stand today? What proportion of physicians are still not using cytovery versus what proportion have returned they're used to normal? That's the first question. And then the second question, a follow-up to Yigal's. Speaker 1200:45:28On the 90% share, what do you attribute that to? Is it the 2 year data that you have versus the 2 year data that IsoRay's presented or is it execution issues? What do you think is enabling the 90% share that you currently have? Thanks. Speaker 400:45:48Hey, Phil, it's Adam. Thanks for the question. So yes, we haven't done any new research since the last wave of the what I call the 3rd, a third, a third. One thing we have seen anecdotally is that each of those segments have started to use, cyfobri again. So the segment that has stopped, we really spent time with those physicians. Speaker 400:46:09We were there. We were being incredibly transparent about these rare cases of vasculitis and we waited. And once those physicians were ready, we then step back up. And so we started to see physicians that had stopped restart. Same for the segment of new patients only, again, we've had a couple of physicians that I know of anecdotally that have said, no, I've started new patients again based on the benefit risk profile of the drug. Speaker 400:46:39And we continue to see growth in those accounts that did not stop. They continue to see the benefit of this drug. So whilst we don't have haven't done that wave of market research again, I do believe we're really impacting those 3 segments. Now the second part of your question, the 90% is, I think it's down to a lot of things, right? Continued strong execution from the team, particularly over the last few months. Speaker 400:47:08We've been incredibly transparent with the and I think we spent a lot of time building trust and confidence. Physicians now I believe truly see the benefits of our overall clinical profile. So this is long term efficacy from Gale, real world safety in over 200,000 doses since launch. Dosing flexibility, the vast majority of physicians, as I said before, are leaning towards 6 to 8 weeks. We have strong payer coverage with our J code from October 1. Speaker 400:47:37I think it's all of those things coming together, but the efficacy profile of this drug, I think stands up high. And this is a drug you choose for its efficacy, the impact it can have on patients' vision moving forward. So we are laser focused on communicating our benefit risk and the benefit of this drug with physicians. And I think that will make a difference. Caroline, anything you want to add? Speaker 100:48:03I think it's like just to hone a little more on the efficacy story, the fact that we have the data from Gale with up to 3 years of data now that's, they really appreciate that this data is so thoughtful and also includes visual function with up to 42% reduction in GA lesion growth. That's something that's amazing. And the fact that every other month dosing into Gail in non subfoldial patients is so meaningful. So the first thing for physicians is the efficacy story, the experience with the company and then their experience using the product. And that's sort of where doctors are getting that experience now. Speaker 100:48:46The initial patients who came in were with physicians who are in our clinical study, which was so large, and now we're reaching all the other physicians in the community. Speaker 1200:48:57That's very helpful. Thank you. Operator00:49:08Our next question comes from Rakesh Chirauri with Jefferies. Your line is open. Speaker 1100:49:13Hi, good morning. Speaker 300:49:14This is Ivy on for Rakesh. Thanks for taking our questions. We just have 2 quick ones on Safari. So when we spoke to our team heading in the train, you had felt confident that the long term split between Safaree and Iserway could be somewhere around like 70 30. So given competitor has commented on their call that either way is currently taking 20% market share after 5 months of launch, How do you feel comfortable that you can maintain this seventythirty split in the long term? Speaker 300:49:43And then secondly, just quickly, why haven't you guided to cephalorimps for 24? And do you plan to guide in later quarters? Thanks. Speaker 600:49:54Thank you so much for that question. Adam, you want to take that? Speaker 400:49:57Hi, Ivy. It's Adam. So yes, as Celestin said, they have a 20% market share. But as I discussed previously, there are multiple ways you can estimate market share. Our assumption is that Astellas is using total vials shipped for a specific time period, so their last quarter versus our last quarter. Speaker 400:50:16What we do is we use real world ECP injection data, which is a snapshot of the current market where physicians are ordering vials and using vials. And we think this is actually a better way of analyzing market share. It actually counts injections rather than looking at vials shipped or revenue. And obviously, there's a total market analysis that we would do. So we're confident that we are the number one GA drug out there. Speaker 400:50:46We also did a time adjusted analysis of our launch versus the competitors' launch. And if you time adjust that you assume they both launch on the same day, ECP or physician demand for XIFAVI was 3 times greater than that of Isova in the 1st 4 months of launch. So that's an incredibly positive metric. We also see that the majority of new patient starts continue to be on Cytovary. And just another point, right, Keep in mind that this market is much larger than we believed from 1,000,000 patients to 1.5. Speaker 400:51:21I think it can accommodate more than one product, but we truly believe that we are the number one product and we expect to maintain that leadership over time. So hopefully that answers your question, Ivy. I'll hand to Tim for the next call. Speaker 500:51:34I'll take the guidance question. So obviously after the past year, we felt we needed a little more time before we could guide effectively. And case in point, we've never been through a Q1 where we have recertifications or the like. So we're just going to take our time and make sure we understand the dynamics over the course of a full year and we'll get back to you on when we plan to guide. Thanks. Operator00:52:01One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Ellie Merle with UBS. Your line is open. Speaker 1300:52:14Hi, guys. Thanks for taking the question and congrats on all the progress. I just want to follow-up on the quarter over quarter growth question asked earlier. You said you're seeing January February as 2 Speaker 100:52:24of the strongest months since launch Speaker 1300:52:26and the sampling rate did not increase. So shouldn't 1Q be higher than 4Q? I guess how do we balance that with the seasonality commentary? I just want to clarify on that point. And then just a second question. Speaker 1300:52:38In terms of compliance and dosing frequency, are you seeing any trends in differences in compliance or dosing frequency at different types of sites such as private equity owned versus academic? Thanks. Speaker 400:52:51Hi, Eddie, it's Adam. So, yes, so we've been seasonality does impact drugs within this market. As I said, I used the analogs that we found from the anti VEGF. We did see recertifications happen a lot in January and leak into February and impacted on the weather. We do believe that January February are likely to be 2 of our largest months. Speaker 400:53:18So we're executing flawlessly and pushing to make Q1 as big as it possibly can be by being incredibly thoughtful in how we interact with these physicians. So the team is flawlessly executing. I'm incredibly proud of them and we're pushing incredibly hard. As you would expect us to, we believe we have the number one GA drug moving forward. Compliance, as I said, it's a touch early for compliance. Speaker 400:53:46We tend to see the vast majority of patients being 6 to 8 weeks and they seem to be very comfortable with that. We have not noticed any difference that I'm aware of between compliance at PE backed practices versus non PE backed practices. We have a nice wide range of business rights. PE backed practices are about 30% of our business and the rest, the remaining 70% are independent practices and academic practices. To my knowledge, we haven't seen any differences in terms of compliance from those groups. Speaker 400:54:21As I said, we've just exited the 1st year. I think as we get into years 2 and 3 of treatment with this drug, that's when physicians will have to have a conversation with their patients back in clients, but it's too early for now. Speaker 100:54:36Great. Thanks. Operator00:54:39One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Francois Brisebois with Oppenheimer. Your line is open. Speaker 800:54:53Hi, this is Dan Tangone on for Frank Riese. Thanks for taking our questions. Related to a question regarding the physician segments from the market research. Now with the permanent J code effective and the gale extension readout, are you starting to see an impact within that 1 third segment of physicians who are on the sidelines? Speaker 400:55:15Yes. Thanks for the question. So yes, obviously, we haven't redone that market research, but we are starting to see an impact from physicians who are on the sideline. The J code unlocked all of that. We continue, it's my favorite metric. Speaker 400:55:29We continue to see double digit new accounts sign up to use SYFOVRI every week since launch. That has continued. That tells you that these physicians are no longer on the sidelines that keep starting to want to start patients. I think that's an incredibly positive metric for us. So yes, whilst we haven't done the research anecdotally, we're hearing that those physicians who are on the sidelines have started to go. Speaker 400:55:54We do have some upside opportunity too, right? So we have about 1800 sites of care across the U. S. That's about 50% of our potential target list. So there's still an opportunity for growth for us to target that other half of the market. Speaker 400:56:12And we have some good plans to go and execute that, which we started in the Q1 and expect to move into the for the rest of the year. So hopefully that answers your question. Speaker 800:56:23Understood. Congrats on the quarter. Speaker 400:56:27Thank you. Thank you. Operator00:56:28One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Joseph Springer with Needham. Your line is open. Speaker 1200:56:46Hi, good morning and thanks for taking our question. Just a quick one on potential switching dynamics. Just curious if you could provide any metrics or data or even qualitative feedback that you're hearing so far on any switching dynamics between XIFABI and ISA rate? Speaker 600:57:07Yes. I think thank you so much, Zoe. Great to hear you. Look, that is a place where I think we are very well positioned as well. At the end of the day, where the metrics will stand out is the comparator between on efficacy as well as on safety, right? Speaker 600:57:23So and on the efficacy, quite frankly, the difference is quite stark, right? I mean, as mentioned before on extra foveal patients up to 42% slowdown versus what has so far been reported as 14%, even though we don't know what it is exactly in the 2nd year for our competing product. And then maybe briefly on the safety, right, that risk that exists on the first injection of developing vasculitis, which is very rare, is something that we now firmly believe is caused by a pre existing allergy towards polyethylene glycol, something that is shared between the products. And we have every reason to expect that both products in the future will have that risk, rare risk associated with it that will then have to be discussed with the patients when a treatment is planned. Speaker 200:58:12Adam, do you want to add something to that? Speaker 400:58:13Yes. Hey, Joey, it's Adam. So yes, no surprise, right? During the rare cases of vasculitis last year, we did see some accounts switch. They switched primarily for safety. Speaker 400:58:26And we know where those accounts are. Now again anecdotally, I have actually seen some physicians switch patients back. So I have seen and heard from my field teams that physicians switched from cyfovary to the competitor and then some of those patients were switched back. So switching does happen in this market. It definitely happened during the rare cases of vasculitis. Speaker 400:58:52But we believe in the profile, the efficacy and the safety and the benefit risk of this drug. And we truly will be focused on making sure we communicate that profile to every physician in this market. Speaker 1200:59:06Great. Thanks so much for the color. Operator00:59:09One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Derek Archila with Wells Fargo. Your line is open. Speaker 1400:59:22Hey, good morning and thanks for taking the questions. Just 2 on Empella. I guess first, have you seen any impact from the launch of Ithacopan in PNH? And I guess how much upside do you think there is in the first line setting from the 10% you discussed today? And then just overall commercial strategy for Empebelli and C3G and MPGM? Speaker 1400:59:42Thanks. Speaker 600:59:44Thank you so much, Derek. Great to hear you. Look, in P and H, we now have a very competitive situation, of course. And our expectations should be commensurate with that competitive situation. So while we don't guide, certainly there will be pressure from this oral product. Speaker 601:00:02I think in general though that it is a great thing that there are now 2 products available to address the problem of extravascular hemolysis in these patients. If we go back a couple of years, as you may recall, because you are already covering us, there was a notion that this was something affecting 7% of patients. That is not true. This is something that affects the overwhelming majority of these patients. And a big segment of patients can and will benefit from this. Speaker 601:00:29And in that sense, raising the awareness around that, having Novartis by our side will be helpful. As we've mentioned before, we're incredibly excited about what we can do in the kidney to the readout of the VALUENT trial this summer and what we will be able to do for the 5,000 patients with T3 gs and ICMP Gen that are in need. Adam, do you want to add something to Speaker 201:00:53Yes. Speaker 401:00:53You said it really well, Cedric, but just to add a few extra bits, right? So Derek, twice a day oral will be appealing to PNH patients for sure. We should expect that. In fact, we've seen 1 or 2 patients switch from Empivalli to the twice a day oral, as you would expect. The vast majority of our patients are really committed to Empivli. Speaker 401:01:17They see the benefits of the efficacy. They see the benefits of the safety profile. And with the auto injector, the Empella injector, we're really improving that convenience aspect of the drug. So we're going to be strongly competitive in the market, but an oral will have an impact. You asked about the first line segment, right? Speaker 401:01:37So I do expect we have 10%. I do expect that the oral will be used nicely within that first line segment. But I've been around the blocker a little bit and every time there's a new entrant into the market and a conversation is had between a physician and a patient, it's a opportunity for Empelli. So if a patient has a conversation with a physician about starting on an oral or switching from Ultomiris or Soliris to an oral, that is an opportunity for us to make sure that Emperevali was in that consideration set. So switching opportunities become particularly important for us during this phase. Speaker 401:02:15And just an execution perspective on nephrology, so we obviously have a great medical affairs, Empella team. We're starting to send that medical affairs team to the nephrology conferences. And that will be the face of the nephrology discussions that we have based on these conferences etcetera until we see some data mid-twenty 24. Speaker 1401:02:40Got it. Thank you. Operator01:02:43One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Douglas Tsao with A. C. Wainwright. Your line is open. Speaker 801:02:56Hi, good morning. Thanks for taking the questions. Just maybe as a follow-up on bilateral treatments. Presumably, there was a slowdown during the vasculitis days. So should we think that relative to your sort of original expectations in terms of how big a part of the business it was, it is smaller? Speaker 801:03:19And are we starting to see sort of some of that catch up? And so should we think about that as sort of some amount of pent up demand of patients who are on-site ovary, but only getting one eye treated, but eventually should most likely convert to bilateral treatment? Thank you. Speaker 101:03:36I think that it's likely that physicians will once they are comfortable and patients have gotten past the first injection or so, then they will be using bilateral for patients just out of convenience for these patients to only have to come in once. So now that we have such a large number of vials that have been used and this robust patient experience to date, I think that we're approaching that. Speaker 401:04:07Yes. Doug, it's Adam. Just to add, I think the bilateral usage was definitely impacted as you said. I expect that to come back, but it's going to be time delayed, right? As we start to communicate with all of these physicians, they've changed their practice on how they do bilateral injections, how the process of how they do it is different based on what happened last year. Speaker 401:04:31I don't think it impacts the opportunity. I think that's just the time delay as physicians get Speaker 201:04:36more comfortable. Speaker 801:04:37No. And I think my sort of question was, is it when we think about a certain number of patients on-site for OTTR today, presumably a higher proportion are just having a single eye treated than you might have originally anticipated, but we should expect those to eventually catch up. So on a like we should see vials per patient increase relative to where we are? Speaker 401:05:02I think you should expect to see bilateral increase, yes, moving forward. Speaker 801:05:07Okay, great. Thank you. Operator01:05:10One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from Garik Sivanavey with Mizuho Securities. Speaker 501:05:24Hey, good morning. Thank you for taking my questions and congratulations on the quarter. Just 2 please. 1, I might have missed this before, but just on the European reexamination process, could you just clarify for me whether as a company during this reexamination period, whether you are able to submit additional data or new analyses? Or is it that the 2 new repertoires provide just a fresh view of the previous data that was included in the original dossier? Speaker 501:05:58So that's my first question. And then my second question, please, just a reminder on the safety profile of Cybovary. Has the rate of vasculitis changed in terms of either increasing or potentially decreasing? Or is it essentially the same? Thank you. Speaker 601:06:16Thank you so much. Great to hear you. First of all, on the European Union, so you are not allowed to include new data, but you are allowed to include new analyses, right? So that is something that we that our team has really done well. And again, especially the microprimatory data is really compelling. Speaker 601:06:36So we'll see what's going to happen. As we mentioned in our field battle, but one that we are excited to take on. Then as it relates to the safety, the rate continues to be at 0.01%, where it has been since July. And of course, that stability provides very good context for physicians to disclose to their patients when they speak with them as to what the risk in front of them is versus the benefit that they can get from being untreated. So unchanged, again, these cases are so rare that for a rate change to become manifest, we're going to have to wait quite a bit. Operator01:07:11Thank you. And I'm not showing any further questions at this time. I'd like to turn the call back over to Cedric for any closing remarks. Speaker 601:07:20Thank you so much everyone for joining. It is a great start to the year for us, and we look forward to sharing much more with all of you as the months come by. And for those of you available later today, we will be here to take questions and answer any further inquiries that you may have. Thank you. Operator01:07:38Ladies and gentlemen, this does conclude today's presentation. You may now disconnect and have a wonderful day.Read morePowered by