Sony Group Q4 2023 Earnings Call Transcript

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Provided by Quartr
February 8, 2024

There are 6 speakers on the call.

Operator

Good morning, everyone. My name is Alan, and I will be your conferencing operator today. I would like to welcome everyone to the FTG 4th Quarter 2023 Analyst Call. All lines have been placed on mute. There will be a question and answer session following the call.

Operator

Please note that this call is being recorded. I would now like to turn the call over to Mr. Brad Born, President and Chief Executive Officer of FTG. Mr. Born, you may proceed.

Speaker 1

Thank you. Good morning. I'm Brad Born, President And CEO of Fran Technology Group Corporation or FTG. Also on the call today is Jamie Creighton, our Chief Financial Officer. Before we go any further, I must caution you that this call may contain forward looking statements.

Speaker 1

Such statements are based on the current expectations of management of the company And inherently involve numerous risks and uncertainties, known and unknown, including economic factors and the company's industry generally. The proceeding list is not exhaustive of all possible factors. Such forward looking statements are not guarantees of future performance, and actual Events and results could differ materially from those expressed or implied by forward looking statements made by the company. The listener is cautioned to consider these and other factors carefully When making decisions with respect to the company and not place undue reliance on forward looking statements. The company does not undertake and has no specific intention to update any forward looking statements Written or oral that may be made from time to time by or on its behalf whether a result of new information, future events or otherwise.

Speaker 1

2023 continued to improve as the year progressed and it ended on a high note. Revenues increased each Quarter throughout the year with Q4 revenues totaling $40,000,000 The 4th quarter sales were FTG's best quarter ever 2020 Street sales of over $135,000,000 were also a record for the company. It was a great year for FTG and was Achieved by a great team of people at our company. I'd like to thank everyone at FTG for their hard work and their contributions to our success. Throughout 2023, The book to bill ratio for the year was 1.11:one.

Speaker 1

FTG's backlog increased from $65,000,000 at the start of the year to 97,000,000 At year end, the two acquisitions added approximately $18,000,000 of backlog as of their closing date. FTG's full year revenues increased by $45,000,000 or 51 percent to $135,200,000 including $22,900,000 from the FTG achieved EBITDA of $22,500,000 and adjusted EBITDA of $19,400,000 in 20.23 Compared to EBITDA of $8,600,000 or adjusted EBITDA of $8,800,000 in 2022. The adjustments in 'twenty three included A reduction to eliminate $3,800,000 in government support received earlier in the year offset by an increase to add back $600,000 in acquisition related costs. FTG achieved net income of $11,600,000 and adjusted net earnings of 7,000,000 For fiscal 2023 compared to $700,000 or adjusted $900,000 respectively for 2022. The adjustments in net earnings were the same as noted for EBITDA plus eliminating $1,500,000 in deferred tax recovery from the acquisitions in 2023.

Speaker 1

In 2023, FTG had positive cash flow from operations of $12,900,000 included in this is the sale of the Chatsworth facility And the government support received early in 2023 offset by the acquisition related costs. The reported cash flow is after investments and CapEx of $6,500,000 and R and D of $5,900,000 FTG also invested $25,400,000 in the 2 acquisitions in 2020 Which is not included in cash from operations. FTG maintained its Triumph balance sheet with net debt of $3,600,000 at year end after Noted investments in CapEx and R and D and the $25,000,000 for acquisition. This debt represents The debt to adjusted EBITDA ratio of 0.2:one. Other accomplishments in 2023 included, In April, we completed the acquisition of Holiday Circuits based in Minnetonka, Minnesota.

Speaker 1

This business is now operating as FTG Circuits Minnetonka And Brink's U. S. Based advanced circuit board technology to enable FTG to grow its presence in the defense HDI or high technology market. Also in April, we completed the acquisition of IMI based in Haverhill, Massachusetts, north of Boston. This Business is now operating as FTG Circa's Haverhill and brings RF substrate offering to FTG's customers in the U.

Speaker 1

S. Planned integration activities at both Acquisitions progressed well through 2023 with improved throughput, improved pricing, cost savings and FTG ERP implementation well underway at Circus Minnetonka and cost savings, equipment investments and growth plans at Circus Avril. More activities and full FTG ERP implementation for both sites are planned for 220 staff in 2023 with about 175 being the result of acquisitions and the remaining 45 were to support growth across In support of the new acquisitions and the overall growth of FTG, Leo LeCroy was hired as Executive Vice President, Circuits to oversee FTG's U. S. Circuits operations, including the newly acquired sites.

Speaker 1

Leo has extensive senior management experience in the circuit board industry selling into the defense market. FTG received $3,200,000 in additional funding for a total of $5,200,000 under the Canadian Aerospace Regional Recovery And $500,000 from the Ontario government under their Advanced Manufacturing and Innovation Competitiveness or AMIC program. And in June, FTG was approved for a second NCIB following on from the one in place over the previous 12 FPG has authorized to purchase up to 5% of its common shares expanding over a 12 month period. Minimal shares were purchased during 2023. Jamie will provide more details on the full year results as well as Q4.

Speaker 1

Let me turn to some external items. Our end market demand remains strong. Air travel continues to rebound. Airbus delivered about 650 aircraft in 2023. But more importantly, they're looking to ramp to almost 1,000 aircraft annually in the next few years and this is a 50% production rate increase.

Speaker 1

Airbus has a backlog of over 8,000 orders which is over a decade worth of production at current production rates. At Boeing, they shipped just under 500 planes in 2023 and have plans to ramp their production by about 40% To almost 700 planes in the next few years. Boeing's backlog is almost 6,000 planes, so also over a decade's worth of orders at current production rates. But the FAA has told Boeing to halt their production rate increases while they ensure there is sufficient focus on quality. But overall, it is clear why both companies are looking to ramp their production.

Speaker 1

In the business jet market, Bombardier is expected to report low single digit or low double digit shipments production rate increases for 2023 when they report the results, which they did this morning. In the helicopter market, Bell Helicopter reported a 31% revenue growth In 2023 and are projecting near 10% growth for 2024. All of this bodes well for us as we look to future demand in the coming years. I've also looked at results from key defense contractors in the U. S.

Speaker 1

And all of them reported revenue growth in 2023 Between 2% and 7.5% over 2022. Looking at the longer term, Boeing's most recent 20 year forecast shows long term industry growth And it continues to show 20% of all new aircraft deliveries going to China and close to 40% to As has been the case in the recent forecast, the business jet market has already seen traffic recover. Our recent business jet market forecast from Honeywell similarly predicts growth in this market in the coming years with near term double digit growth rates for the sector. The simulator market mirrors the end market application. But as we always remind everyone about this market, It is lumpy, so large year to year variations do occur.

Speaker 1

As we have said for many years, FTG's goal is in all segments of the aerospace and defense market as each moves through their independent business cycles. It's not often all segments are growing as seems to be the case now. Beyond all this, let me give you a quick update on some key metrics for FTG for 2023. First, as already noted, The leading indicator of our business is our bookings and new orders. As noted earlier, our bookings were $149,500,000 a year, Plus we acquired $17,000,000 in bookings when the acquisition closed for a total of over $166,000,000 in new orders for the year.

Speaker 1

This resulted in a backlog of $97,000,000 at year end. In 2023 sales were $135,000,000 which $45,000,000 above 2022 sales. About half the growth came from existing sites, while the balance was from the 2 acquisitions. Excluding the acquisitions, FTG's organic growth in 2023 was approximately 25%. The organic growth was closer to 15% at our circuits business and 35% in our aerospace business.

Speaker 1

Aerospace saw rebound and simulator activity in 2023 and we won some significant new high level flight assemblies That converted to revenue late in 2023. In our Q4, aerospace sales grew by close to 40% as a result. For the acquisition sequential revenue growth was approximately 12% from Q3 to Q4 As we work to ramp them to the expected revenue level, in particular at Circus Minnetonka, the run rate in Q4 It was over $27,000,000 This was about halfway from where they were in 2022 To their pre pandemic levels, they're showing good progress towards getting them to revenue levels where they will materially In our Aerospace business, sales were up 35% or $12,000,000 in 2023 compared to last All sites were up. On the circuit side of our business, sales in 23 were up 32,000,000 or 53% on a year over year basis. Just under 70% of the growth came from the acquisition and the balance of 30% was from organic growth at existing sites.

Speaker 1

Overall at FTG, our top 5 customers accounted for 56.1% of total revenue. This compares to 55.7% last year. Also interesting to note, of the top 10 customers, 6 are customers shared between circuits and aerospace. We particularly like to see the As a means, we are maximizing our penetration of these customers by selling both cockpit products and circuit boards. In 2023, 30 3.7% of our total revenues came from our Aerospace business compared to 38.6% last year.

Speaker 1

Aerospace business share decreased, partly The impact from the acquisitions offset by growth in simulator and other high value assemblies. I would now like to turn the call over to Jamie, who will summarize our financial results for 2023 and afterwards I will talk about some key priorities we are working on.

Speaker 2

Jamie? Thanks, Brad, and good morning, everyone. I'd like to provide some additional detail on our financial performance On sales of $135,200,000 FGG achieved a post margin $39,300,000 or 29.1 percent in 20.3 percent compared to $21,300,000 or 20 3.8 percent on sales of $89,600,000 in 2022. Excluding government subsidies, The gross margin was $36,100,000 or 26.7 percent in 2023 as compared to 21,000,000 4% in 2022. The increase in gross margin dollars and the gross margin rate is the result of higher sales volumes from the newly acquired Circuitsight's operational improvements, including favorable pricing actions and favorable foreign exchange Revenue per employee was 225,000 in 2023 as compared to 194,000 In 2022, which is a 16% increase.

Speaker 2

In Q4 2023 on sales of 40,000,000 FGG achieved a gross margin of $10,700,000 or 26.7 percent compared to $5,700,000 or 24.2 percent on sales of $23,800,000 in Q4 2022. The increase in gross margin dollars Q4 as compared to Q4 last year is primarily the result of increased sales volumes in both the circuits And Aerospace segments, operational improvements including pricing actions and favorable foreign exchange rates. From a geographical FGG achieved strong sales growth in each region in 2023 with the exception of a $200,000 decrease in Canada and flat sales in our other region. In 2023, 78 percent of FTG sales were derived from customers in the United States, which is up 73% in the prior year as both the businesses acquired in 2023 principally sell into the SG and A expense was $17,000,000 or 12.5 sales in 2023 as compared to $12,700,000 or 14.1 percent of sales in the prior The increase of $4,300,000 during fiscal 2023 includes expenses from the acquired businesses $1,600,000 increased headcount targeted at operational leadership and increased performance compensation expense. Acquisition and divestiture related expenses were $600,000 for 2023 as compared to $500,000 in 2022.

Speaker 2

In Q4 2023, SG and A expense was 11.9% of sales, which is down 13.3 percent in Q4 2022. R and D costs for 2023 was R and D efforts include product and process improvements at the circuit segment and efforts to develop and qualify products FGG is exposed to currency risk through Transactions, assets and liabilities in foreign currencies, primarily U. S. Dollars. The average exchange rate experienced in $23 was $1.35 compared to $1.30 in 20.22 which equates to a weakening of Canadian dollar of 4%.

Speaker 2

We estimate that for each 1% of weakening of the Canadian FGG would experience an increase in pre tax earnings of just over 400 ks. In 2023, the positive impact was approximately $1,700,000 reduced by realized losses Forward contracts of $100,000 Adjusted EBITDA as described in the press or 9.8 percent of sales for 2022. Adjusted EBITDA is up 120% over 2022 as a result of growing the top line organically, hence through In 2023 excludes the benefit of ERC government assistance of $3,800,000 and adds back acquisition expenses $600,000 Adjusted EBITDA for Q4 2023 was $6,000,000 or 15% of sales as to $2,900,000 or 12.1 percent of sales in Q4 2022. For 20 20 3, FGG recorded net earnings of $11,600,000 as compared to $700,000 in 2022. In addition to the increase in pre tax earnings over last year of 11,700,000 The income tax provision of $2,200,000 equates to an effective tax rate of approximately 16% as compared to 7% in 2022.

Speaker 2

The 2023 tax provision included a deferred tax recovery 1,500,000 which was triggered by a step up in the tax value of certain assets following the 2 acquisitions completed by FGG in 2020 The availability of U. S. Tax losses and the fact that the accounting benefits of these losses have not been previously In the financial segments resulted in a deferred tax recovery. Adjusted net earnings for 20.20 3 was $7,000,000 or $0.29 per diluted share as compared to $900,000 or $0.04 per diluted Items adjusted for net earnings are the same items as adjusted for EBITDA as well as deducting the acquisition related deferred Our net debt position as of Q4 is 3,600,000 as compared to a net cash of 12,300,000 as of Q4 2022. Decrease in cash position It's after investments in capital expenditures of $6,500,000 R and D of $6,600,000 and acquisitions of 25,400,000 Partially offset by the proceeds from the sale leaseback of the Aerospace Chatsworth facility of $8,400,000 Free cash 22.

Speaker 2

Free cash flow in 2023 was negatively impacted by the increase in non cash working capital And to a lesser extent, the increase in CapEx. A key focus area for FGG 2024 It's an improvement in inventory turns. As at the 2023 year end, the corporation's primary source The liquidity totaled $72,200,000 consisting of cash accounts receivable, contract assets and Our revolving credit facility includes US10 $1,000,000 for working capital and US10 $1,000,000 for CapEx, which is committed through July 2026. As of the 2023 year end, outstanding term loans Under this agreement amounted to $3,400,000 leaving nearly $16,600,000 or $22,600,000 of credit availability. Other sources of financing for qualifying investments include loans with the Government of Canada and Province of Ontario.

Speaker 2

There is 1,800,000 Incremental funding available from the Government of Canada through the Aerie program, FTG has received $5,200,000 to the end of Q4 2023 from this program and all such funding is repayable over 5 years without Starting in 2025, we have received $500,000 to date from the Ontario

Speaker 3

loan with additional proceeds

Speaker 2

of up to $2,100,000 in 20.24 of up to $2,100,000 in 2024 and early 2025. Working capital at December 30, 2023 was $41,000,000 Accounts receivable days outstanding were 64 at the This is the 20 In 2022 and accounts payable days were 78 at the 2023 year end as compared to 73 in We entered Q1 2024 with a record level of backlog of $97,000,000 which is an increase of 49% as compared with the start of 2023.

Speaker 1

Our focus will be

Speaker 2

to complete the integration of Our complete set of year end and quarterly filings are now

Speaker 1

Important items in the quarter and or for the future performance of FTG. 2023 was a strong year for FTG. Our sales ramped significantly. We Continue to work hard to ramp further in support of the demand we are seeing. This includes the need to add staff.

Speaker 1

We have now achieved our target headcount across the company to Current demand. While we might tweak it slightly from site to site going forward, the majority of our staffing challenges are behind us. Looking forward, a key item for us remains the integration of our new sites. For Haverhill, we acquired them to grow our presence in the RF circuit board market for aerospace While they are small with a historic run rate of $4,000,000 to $5,000,000 we like their capability. The integration is relatively straightforward as we We intend to continue to operate it in its current facility with its existing staff.

Speaker 1

Our focus will be to engage our sales team with them to find new customers and to grow the This is not an overnight process, but one where we can generate incremental margins and profitability to the benefit of FTG. Going along with this will be some focused CapEx to address a few production constraints to enable future growth. Holiday, our FTG circuit of Minnetonka was a larger acquisition. Their sales were over US30 $1,000,000 before the pandemic. They were hurt by the pandemic like we were.

Speaker 1

We see the long term positioning of Minnetonka to be a source of high technology circuit boards similar to our Toronto facility, but with the U. S. Footprint. This U. S.

Speaker 1

Footprint is critical as we will look to grow our share of the U. S. Only advanced circuit board market and the defense market. In the short term, we have 3 priorities as we integrate Minnetonka into FTG. First, we need to ramp the throughput in sales.

Speaker 1

Since February, they've added about 20 staff going from approximately 150 to 170 people. In Q3, we hired 2 key people. First, we hired back Paul Gottmout who had run our Fredericksburg facility until early in the pandemic. He is back on a temporary basis, But with his operation skills, he has helped immeasurably. It will give us time to find the right person for the long term.

Speaker 1

A week or so after hiring Paul, we hired Leo Lacroix. He is a senior executive from within the circuit board industry With strong aerospace and defense experience. His immediate task was also to focus on Minnetonka, but he has now moved into a larger role And is responsible for FTG's U. S.-based circuit board business. I am confident he will be a huge benefit to FTG for the long term.

Speaker 1

In Minnetonka, the second priority is to reduce material costs. We have identified cost saving opportunities that can benefit this site as they are now part of a larger company. It will take some time to achieve all the savings as in some cases it requires customer approval and internal engineering efforts. But when complete, we expect to Savings on the order of $1,000,000 annually. We continue to make progress on this initiative.

Speaker 1

And our third priority is to improve pricing. We believe Minnetonka had not been sufficiently proactive in adjusting prices up as costs went up. We have had Some successes already and we will continue to address it. We want to ensure any inflationary costs incurred at that site over the past few years, whether material labor or other Our pass through to the customers and not squeeze our margins. While I'm on this topic of pricing, I have been very impressed and pleased Everyone involved in this at FTG has proactively pursued improved pricing at customers through 2023.

Speaker 1

Across FTG, we've done a great job in avoiding any margin squeeze from increased costs due to the recent period of high inflation. We did a detailed dive in some of our key contracts and the price changes achieved and overall it was on the order of 30%. This analysis was done on approximately 20% of our total revenue. And while not specifically pricing, we did receive Some significant expedite purchase orders from customers due to their urgent needs for our product. Some of these expedite fees were taken into income in Q4 and some are remaining for As we enter 2024, we see continued strong demand across most sites.

Speaker 1

Our backlog due in the Q1 is over $48,000,000 including the new sites. We ended the year With $12,500,000 of past due orders which is down from $18,000,000 at the end of Q3, our goal is to continue to reduce this in 2024. But the strike at our Air Toronto facility in December January did not help. As always there are possible downsides or headwinds that could impact our future As just mentioned, the contract with our representative staff in Aero Toronto had expired in August last year and the negotiations did result in a strike 3 weeks in December and 3 weeks in January. This will impact Q1 by an estimated $3,000,000 to $4,000,000 in delayed revenue And the commensurate loss profit.

Speaker 1

But the good news is there is a new contract for the employees that has been ratified and work has returned to normal. Also just to ensure everyone is aware, we have now increased our SG and A costs by approximately $1,000,000 quarterly On about $10,000,000 in incremental quarterly sales from the acquisition. Included in this is about $250,000 per quarter Higher financing costs compared to Q1 last year. We are expecting to grow in 2024. The easiest aspect of our growth We'll be having the acquisitions for the full 12 months as compared to 7 months in 2023.

Speaker 1

This should add an estimated $12,000,000 in sales for 20.24. If we can ramp production and sales at the newly acquired site, this would further add to the growth. Beyond this, we continue to see strong customer demand As I discussed earlier. And we will still see further benefit from the higher value assembly orders first booked in 2023 as we will have these for the full year in 2024. These assemblies go on Boeing and Airbus aircraft and we will see the benefit of the C-nine nineteen program in China moving into production.

Speaker 1

We shipped our first production orders last year and we expect to see production rate increases With the more complex geopolitical situation in China, I'm sure there are still concerns about our activities there. But In 2023, both our operations in China had their best year ever in terms of sales. We We repatriated cash back to Canada during both 20222023. In total, we've now brought back 2,200,000 in cash. By doing this, we don't have as much surplus cash stranded in China and it reduces our exposure if anything's Deteriorated further between China and the West.

Speaker 1

On a more positive note in China, the C919 development program Achieved CAAC certification in 2022 and we are finally in a position to see production orders after our 10 years of development. This will benefit our Chinese operations going forward and will be less susceptible to geopolitical uncertainties. But notwithstanding this good news, We are being cautious about our operations in China and any further increase in tension between China and other countries as that could impact our operations there in the future. We continue to assess possible corporate development opportunities that could fit with either of our businesses. But our near term priority Remains focused on integrating our recent acquisition.

Speaker 1

With a focus on operational excellence in all parts of STG, our strong financial performance in 2023, Our recent acquisition and our key sales wins, we are confident we are on a long term growth trajectory. This

Operator

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question and answer One moment please for your first question. Your first question comes from Nick Corcoran of Acumen. Your line is already open.

Speaker 4

Good morning, guys. Congrats on a record quarter.

Speaker 2

Thank you. Thank you.

Speaker 4

There's been a lot of headlines Related to safety issues at Boeing, have you seen any changes in the level of orders related to Boeing or they Remain relatively stable.

Speaker 1

They are stable. And here's the way it's working right now with Boeing. So There's really 2 things that you can track at Boeing. You can shift you can track deliveries, which are definitely halted while they sort out their latest challenges. And you can track production rates.

Speaker 1

Boeing has not changed their production rates yet as a result of any of their challenges. So The demand down into the supply chain is driven by production rates. So we're seeing no change. The only thing I would say is going forward, As I mentioned, Boeing had plans to ramp, specifically on the 737. I think they're at 38 planes a month.

Speaker 1

They're trying to get to 40 then get 50 in 2025, FAA has explicitly told them to not ramp their production until Everyone's confident that they have their quality under control. So there could be a risk to the increase in production rates, But I don't see much of a risk to decreasing production rates as of now. That's helpful. And then you indicated the

Speaker 4

start will impact the Q1 by $3,000,000 to $4,000,000 Do you think you'll be able to catch up on those orders through the balance of the fiscal year?

Speaker 1

Yes. I mean it's we're getting Lots of pressure from our customers. They all need the parts. The demand has not gone away. So it's delayed, but definitely I do expect it To be caught up in 2024.

Speaker 4

And then the last question for me, How will the loss revenue in the Q1 impact your operating leverage? And can you maybe comment on What the magnitude of the wage increase for the salary employees was at Circuit Toronto or Aerospace Toronto?

Speaker 1

Sure, Toronto. Right. Yes. And I don't have great answers on either of these. In terms of The profit impact, my simplistic analysis is, I think the revenues impacted $3,000,000 to 4,000,000 Normally, we say our contribution rate is around 30%.

Speaker 1

So you could say that 30% of that lost revenue hits the bottom line. In terms of the wage increase, I don't have a dollar amount, but wages Are typically running at 20% to 30% of my cost at a site And that's all wages. The operator level is going to be a smaller percentage of that. And so, even if we say the operator wages are 20% of my total cost, and if the increase was 10%, which it wasn't quite, but if in this year, I'd be Which it wasn't quite but if in this year I'd be hitting my margins by 2% basically 10% of 20%.

Operator

Your next question comes from Ashwin Marjani of Edward Jones. Your line is already open.

Speaker 3

Thanks. Congrats Brad and Jamie. It's good to see everything ramping up very well. Given the large backlog, Are there any thoughts on wrapping production above the existing capacity even if you take into account The acquisition is running at full tilt. Just wanted to hear your thoughts on that because you have about $48,000,000 I think you said.

Speaker 3

So yes, just thoughts on that.

Speaker 1

Sure. And it's yes, definitely there's thoughts on continuing to ramp our production. And I did say we're kind of fast at a comfortable level now. Last year we were struggling to get fast to ramp up. We're Happy where we are.

Speaker 1

But if we continue to see the strong demand and we continue to win opportunities with 100% Certainly, I would love to continue to ramp our revenues and our production in the coming quarters years. So for sure, we would Love to do that. And I believe that market demand is there to support that.

Speaker 3

Definitely. Thank you.

Operator

Your next question comes from Austin Beutel of Oak West. Your line is already open.

Speaker 1

Brad, can you elaborate a little bit on

Speaker 5

the receipt of subsidies or Loans or whatever from the government. So it's a substantial portion of the gross margin in the last I admire it and it's wonderful. Are you very do you feel strongly about it being continued proportionately?

Speaker 1

I guess a couple of comments. We have 2 types of government support. Early in 'twenty three, we had government support that hit the P and L increased our margins. That was basically in Q1 last year. Since then, Most of our support has really been to help our balance sheet.

Speaker 1

It's low or no interest loans. So those are not going through the P and L in the last few quarters. And I guess So that's what we had. Then to comment on going forward, I don't see much in terms of government subsidies that are going to help the P and L going forward, but these interest or low interest loans we have from the government both Canada and Ontario We'll stay on our balance sheet that the loans from Canada that hopefully will total about $7,000,000 will carry through till 2,030. So those Will be a benefit to us on the balance sheet and on financing for a number of years still.

Speaker 5

Thank you. Congratulations on a great quarter.

Speaker 4

Thank you, sir.

Operator

There are no further questions at this time. I would hand over the call to Mr. Bourne for closing comments. Please proceed.

Speaker 1

Thank you. The replay of the call will be available on the numbers noted in our press release until March 8, and it will also be available on our website a few days, I thank you all for your interest and participation. Thank you.

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes today's conference call. Thank you for your participation and you may now disconnect.

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Sony Group Q4 2023
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