Ameriprise Financial Q4 2024 Earnings Call Transcript

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Operator

Welcome to the today's interview the call will begin in one minute welcome to the Q4 2024 Earnings Call. My name is Mark, and I will be your operators for today's call. At this time, all participants are in listen-only mode. Later, we will conduct a question-and-answer session. During the question-and-answer session, if you have a question, please press R1 on your touchstone phone. As a reminder, the conference is being recorded. I will now turn the call over to Stephanie. Stephanie, you may begin.

Stephanie M. Rabe
Investor Relations at Ameriprise Financial

And good morning. Welcome to AmeriPrice Financial's 4th-Quarter Earnings Call. On the call with me today are Jim, Chairman and CEO; and Walter Berman, Chief Financial Officer. Following their remarks, we'd be happy to take your questions. Turning to our earnings presentation materials that are available on our website. On Slide 2, you will see a discussion of forward-looking statements. Specifically, during the call, you will hear references to various non-GAAP financial measures, which we believe provide insight into the company operations. Reconciliation of non-GAAP numbers to their respective GAAP numbers can be found in today's materials and on our website at some statements that we make on this call may be forward-looking, reflecting management's expectations about future events and overall operating plans and performance. These forward-looking statements speak only as of today's date and involve a number of risks and uncertainties. A sample list of factors and risks that could cause actual results to be materially different from forward-looking statements can be found in our 4th-quarter 2024 earnings release, our 2023 Annual Report to shareholders and our 2023 10-K report. We make no obligation to publicly update or revise these forward-looking statements. On Slide 3, you see our GAAP financial results at the top of the page for the 4th-quarter. Below that, you see our adjusted operating results, which management believes enhances the understanding of our business by reflecting the underlying performance of our core operations and facilitates a more meaningful trend analysis. Many of the comments that management makes on the call today will focus on adjusted operating results. And with that, I'll turn it over to Jim.

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Good morning, everyone. Thanks for joining our earnings call. As you saw, Ameriprise delivered a strong 4th-quarter to complete an excellent year. We're building on our good client engagement and demonstrating the strength of our value propositions. Also achieved a number of new records that we'll discuss with you. Regarding the external environment, equity markets were strong amid resilient US economic growth and labor markets. As inflation cooled, the Fed lowered interest rates for the third time in late 2024. However, it looks like there'll be a slower pace for rate cuts this year. With strong business growth and positive markets, assets under management, administration and advisement grew to $1.5 trillion, up 10%. And for our adjusted operating results, we achieved some new highs in the quarter. Total revenues were $4.5 billion, up 13% from strong asset growth and transactional activity. Earnings were $965 million, up 18% with earnings per diluted share up 23% to $9.54 excluding items we noted. Once again, Ameriprise delivered industry-leading return-on-equity of 52.7%, up from 49.7% a year-ago. Our excellent results demonstrate the strength of our overall business. In Wealth management, our goal-based device value proposition continues to drive excellent adviser productivity, business growth and client satisfaction. Total client assets grew to $1 trillion at year end, up 14% from good flows and markets. For the quarter, total client inflows were $11.3 billion, further strengthening from the 3rd-quarter. Wrap assets under management were also up substantially growing 18% to $574 billion, making ours one of the largest platforms in the industry. Wrap flows grew significantly, up 59% to more than $11 billion, which marks an all-time high. This represents an 8% annualized flow rate. We also had another significant pickup in transactional activity, up 17% from a year-ago. Clients continue to hold a higher-level of cash. However, we're seeing a shift from term into wrap and other products. We expect more cash to be put to work and greater transactional activity as we move through 2025. With regard to our advisors, productivity grew nicely again, up 13% to a new record of over $1 million per advisor, reflecting our consistent investments in best-in-class capabilities and support. A key strength of our value proposition is our integrated technology platform and the outstanding value it creates. Our advisers are leveraging our digital tools, CRM as well as our excellent data analytics and solutions to further serve client needs and deepen relationships. The team and I are proud of the recognition that Ameriprise consistently earns in the marketplace. Our client satisfaction is excellent at 4.9 out of five. And for the sixth year in a row, JD Power recognized our phone support for providing an outstanding customer service experience to advisers. In addition, Ameriprise also received JD Power certification for our phone support for clients. And our advisers also continue to stand-out in the industry for their exceptional service, leading growth and high-quality practices. In fact, we had a record 427 teams on the Forbes best-in state wealth Management team's 2024 ranking, which is terrific. Maintaining excellent engagement with our advisers is another key strength. A recent field survey indicated that 90% of our advisers recommend Ameriprise is a great place to work or affiliate with. This high-level of advisor satisfaction with Ameriprise also benefits our recruiting efforts. In the 4th-quarter, we attracted another 91 experienced productive advisers, marking a nice increase in what is the slower time of year for recruiting and we feel-good about our pipeline. With regard to our bank, we continue to generate attractive earnings with balances growing to more than $23 billion, and we see further opportunity to expand our product set with CDs, ELOCs and checking accounts as we move through 2025. Speaking of products, our retirement protection solutions continue to drive strong sales growth and earnings. As I mentioned, we have very good transactional activity in AWM. Part of that included our strong variable annuity sales up 15% for the quarter with robust growth in our structured product. And we also had good sales in our life business, where we focused on VOL and disability products that are appropriate for the environment. Life and health sales grew meaningfully up 26% and the team continues to enhance how we do business, including with accelerated underwriting. Our retirement and protection solutions continue to help us meet clients' comprehensive needs while generating substantial free-cash flow. In Asset Management, we're generating strong financial results as we leverage and evolve our global capabilities for greater efficiency and future growth. For the quarter, assets under management and advisement was $681 billion. The team is delivering consistent competitive investment performance with excellent research and thought leadership. At year end, nearly 70% of our funds globally were above the medium across one and three-year time-frames and 80% or more of our funds outperformed for the five and 10-year period. And we continue to have strong performance in key strategies, including our anchor and strategic funds in the US. In total, 108 Columbia thread needle funds earned four and five-star Morningstar ratings. Regarding flows, we had net inflows of $1.3 billion, a more than $6 billion improvement from a year-ago. In retail, we had total net inflows of $6.1 billion, reflecting stronger gross sales in North-America and EMEA as well as higher reinvested dividends. In Institutional, we had net outflows of $3.9 billion, excluding legacy insurance partner flows due to slower fundings and the expected outflows we've highlighted. To drive future flows, we continue to broaden our investment capabilities to both complement our legacy mutual fund business and meeting evolving market demand. This includes building out our active ETF lineup and further growing our SMA and model delivery businesses. In fact, we had nearly $3 billion of model delivery inflows for the year and our assets under advisement are now over $35 billion, making us the seventh largest provider in the US. For asset management overall, we're completing two years of transformational work that will provide benefits this year and beyond. This includes improved efficiency and evolving the business to better meet client needs, especially in EMEA. And you will continue to see us tightly manage expenses. At the same time, we're investing for growth. Consistent with our firm-wide investments in asset management, we continue to build-out our product-line, data, analytics, AI and other capabilities. Reflecting on the firm overall, it was another strong quarter and year for Ameriprise. We built on a unique 130-year legacy and reinforced our ability to consistently achieve excellent results. Ameriprise continues to deliver strong organic growth and free-cash flow with best-in-class capital returns and an excellent capital position. In the quarter, we returned another $768 million and $2.8 billion for the year. Over the last five years, we returned a substantial amount of capital to shareholders, nearly $12 billion, which resulted in a share count reduction of 22%. And our ROE is consistently one of the best-in the industry and is now 52.7%. Another important differentiator for Ameriprise, we continue to stand-out for our culture and how we operate the business. In fact, we were just recognized again as one of America's Most Responsible companies in 2025 by Newsweek and one of America's Best Companies in 2025 by Forbes. I'm proud of what the Ameriprise team has accomplished and we're in an attractive position for 2025. Now Walter will provide more detail on the quarter and then we'll take your questions. Walter?

Walter S. Berman
Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Thank you, Jim. Ameriprise delivered another excellent quarter across its operating segments to conclude a strong 2024. Adjusted operating EPS increased 23% to $9.54 in the quarter and increased 17% for the year, excluding severance expense, mark-to-market impacts on share-based compensation, our prior year regulatory accrual and unlocking. This demonstrates the strong underlying growth achieved in the quarter and in the year. Assets under management, administration and advisement increased 10% to $1.5 trillion, benefiting from strong client flows over the past year and equity market appreciation. This resulted in strong 13% revenue growth across our businesses. G&A expenses continue to be well-managed and demonstrate our focus on operating efficiency and effectiveness while investing in areas that will drive future business growth, particularly in wealth Management to achieve sustainable shareholder objectives. And we delivered a strong consolidated margin of 27%. Our stable 90% free-cash flow generation across our diversified businesses, coupled with strong balance sheet fundamentals enabled us to return $768 million or 81% of the operating earnings to shareholders in the quarter. In 2024, we returned $2.8 billion or 78% of operating earnings to shareholders and our ROE was best-in-class at 52.7%. On Slide 6, you'll see the strong metrics results from wealth Management. Client assets grew 14% to an all-time high of $1 trillion with strong client flows of $11.3 billion. Wrap assets were up 18% to $574 billion. Wrap flows were particularly strong in the quarter at $11.1 billion or an 8% annual annualized flow rate. Strong flows coupled with continued growth and transactional activity generated strong revenue growth and revenue per advisor reached a new high of $1 million, up 13% from a year-ago. Total cash balances, including third-party money market funds and brokered CDs were $85.4 billion, which was over 8% of client assets. However, the pace in which money is flowing into money market funds has decreased significantly and we are beginning to see clients put money back to work-in wrap and other products on our platform. We expect this to continue over-time as markets and rates normalize, which creates a significant opportunity. And in the quarter, client suite balances increased $2.3 billion sequentially to $29.8 billion. On Slide 7, you see the strong financial results from Wealth Management. Pre-tax adjusted operating earnings increased 18% to $823 million, driven by core business growth and strong equity markets, which more than offset the approximately $20 million impact from Fed funds, rate cuts and the portfolio repositioning. Adjusted operating net revenues increased 18% to $2.8 million of growth all on asset and increased transactional activity. Adjusted operating expenses in the quarter increased 18% with distribution expense up 23%, reflecting business growth and higher transactional activity. G&A expenses were $438 million in the quarter and were up 5% to $1.7 billion for the full-year. This was in-line with expectations, reflecting investment for growth and higher volume-related expenses. Margins remained strong at 29%. Turning to Asset Management on Slide 8. Financial results were very strong in the quarter. Operating earnings increased 29% to $251 million, consistent with full-year growth of 28% versus last year. This strong quarter and annual performance was driven by proactive expense management-related to our operating model transformation and strong markets, more than offsetting outflows similar to the industry. Total assets under management and advisement increased 3% to $681 billion. Revenues grew 10%, reflecting strong marks and performance fees as well as the impact from net outflows. Adjusted operating expenses increased 4%. General and administrative expenses, excluding higher-performance fee compensation, improved 2% in the quarter and 3% for the year, reflecting benefits from the company's initiatives to enhance operating efficiencies and effectiveness to further strengthen the client experience and future profitability. Those transformation initiatives will continue to benefit results. Margins reached 39% in the quarter and 38% for the full-year, up from 32% in the prior year with similar levels of performance fees in both years. Let's turn to Slide nine. Retirement and protection Solutions continued to deliver strong earnings and free-cash flow generation, reflecting the high-quality of the business that was built over a long period of time. Pre-tax adjusted operating earnings in the quarter increased 5% to $213 million, reaching $816 million for the full-year. The strong and consistent performance of the business reflected the benefit from stronger interest earnings and higher equity markets, partially offset by higher distribution expense associated with continued strong sales trends. Overall, Retirement Protection Solutions sales were up nicely with protection sales up 26% to $91 million, primarily in higher-margin VUL products and variable annuity sales up 15% to $1.2 billion. In the Corporate segment, I wanted to mention long-term care pretax adjusted operating earnings were $21 million or $62 million for the full-year, excluding unlocking. Results in the quarter reflected higher closed claims and new premium rate increases. Turning to the balance sheet on Slide 10. Balance sheet fundamentals and free-cash flow generation remain strong with $2 billion of excess capital. Our diversified and high-quality investment portfolio continues to perform well. As I have noted before, we repositioned approximately one-third of our floating-rate securities in the bank portfolio into fixed-rate securities with a 5% yield and a three-year duration. This positions us well moving forward. We have diversified sources of dividends from all our businesses, enabled by strong underlying fundamentals. This supports our ability to consistently return capital to shareholders and invest for future business growth. Ameriprise's consistent capital return strategy drives long-term shareholder value. In summary, on Slide 11, Ameriprise delivered excellent growth in the 4th-quarter, which is a continuation of a long track-record of outperforming our stated financial targets. In 2024, revenues grew 11%, earnings per share as-adjusted increased 17%. Return-on-equity grew 300 basis-points and we returned $2.8 billion of capital to shareholders. We have similar growth trends over the past five years with 8% compounded annual revenue growth, 17% compounded annual EPS growth, return-on-equity improved over 14 percentage points and we returned $12 billion of capital to shareholders. These trends are consistent over the long-term as well. This differentiated performance across multiple cycles speaks to the complementary nature of our business mix as well as our focus on profitable growth. With that, we'll take your questions.

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Operator

Thank you. We will now begin the question-and-answer session. If you have a question, please press star one on your touchstone phone. If you wish to be removed from the queue, please press star. If you are using a speaker phone, you may need to pick-up the handset first people pressing the numbers. Once again, if you have a question, please press star one on your touchstone phone. And your first question comes from the line of Sunit Kamat with Jefferies. Sunit, please go-ahead.

Suneet Kamath
Analyst at Jefferies Financial Group

Great. Thank you. Good morning. I wanted to start with the bank. You know, the NII there was down sequentially and year-over-year. I know Walter in the past, you've talked about an expectation that maybe '25, 2025 NII would be above '24. Is that still your expectation? And can you maybe walk-through some of the pieces that kind of get you there?

Walter S. Berman
Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Sure, Sunni. So coming into the quarter, we were at 75% fixed in the bank and 25% floating. And during the quarter, we repositioned that down to 17%. So we've now basically have managed that aspect. And in the quarter, we also grew our base by about $2.3 billion and from both seasonal and growth. So that's the positioning coming in. So going-forward, I think we're sitting in a good position because of the fundamentals that we have right now. We also have taken in January, we studied the client credit rate and we've adjusted that accordingly with the change in the interest rates. So all the fundamentals that we see are positioning us quite well. I think again in the bank to certainly sustain and continue net interest income, but there's a lot of variables, but that I think our positioning has put us in good position. As it relates to now looking at sweep, obviously, that will be impacted by rate reduction. And on certificates, that's a spread business and it will be adjusted as rates go. And -- but normally, obviously, you're invested and then you have to -- if you drop your rates, you'll get the benefit. So I would say we're well-positioned as we go into '25 to certainly continue to generate good net interest income. Put it back.

Suneet Kamath
Analyst at Jefferies Financial Group

Got it. Yeah, I got it. Okay, thanks. And then I guess for Jim, you talked about this $85 billion of client cash being 8% of assets. And I think at that level, it's maybe two times the normal roughly 4%, I think is what the historical level has been. So I guess, do you think that we ultimately get back to that 4% to 5% level or we just going to be in this higher cash balance environment for some time? Just want to get a sense of how your advisors are thinking about it.

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Well,, I mean, I think as you saw, you start to see money being redeployed back-in, but we also got more flows in. And the cash levels are higher than what used to be. But remember, you're still sitting with interest rates pretty -- on the short-term of the curve pretty high. And so it is a cash allocation because you're getting good spread, I mean good rate for the consumer there. And -- but as the stabilization occurs in the longer end-of-the curve and that picked-up a little bit, you should start to see some shift over-time there as well. And more money is going back into the market, but not in a like a dramatic way, right? It's more on average over-time. And I would probably say you'll probably see a continued pickup in fixed-income type of product as well. But yes, I would say over-time, the cash position will come down, but it's -- the rates didn't -- they dropped 100 basis-points on the short-end of the curve, but they're still much higher than they were over the last 10 years.

Suneet Kamath
Analyst at Jefferies Financial Group

Got it. Okay. All right. That's helpful. Thanks.

Operator

And your next question comes from the line of Brennan Hawken with UBS Financial. Brennan, please go-ahead, your line is now open.

Brennan Hawken
Analyst at UBS Group

Sorry, I mute on. Thanks for taking my question. Good morning, Jim and Walter. Walter would love to put a finer point on the NII at the bank commentary. So it sounds like now you're working towards stability in that NII number as a constructive outcome. And just wanted to make sure I interpreted that correctly. And then also, I know you lowered the crediting rate here January 8, but it looked like it was about 15 basis-points for most of the tiers. Is -- do you expect that will be enough to keep the yield stable here in the first-quarter? Or is it more of a partial offset?

Walter S. Berman
Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Thanks. Okay. So as I indicate, Brian, from a standpoint, we did adjust the rate. We felt that was appropriate looking at the -- what would happen on the deposit base of. So we will continue to evaluate that. Obviously, we go through a competitive process and assess. But we did absorb in the 4th-quarter, 100 basis-point drop, effective 61 in the bank. And so and -- but we did have deposits and those deposits are, like I said, seasonal and growth. And so I say -- I think we're -- as I indicated, we're in good position and we'll to navigate as we go through 2025. So I'm quite confident we were now sitting with 87% in fixed in the bank and high-quality and high-yielding investments.

Brennan Hawken
Analyst at UBS Group

Okay. And then when we think about loan growth, so rates coming down could make particularly the pledge loans, securities-based loans more attractive. But it's been -- the loan growth story within the bank subsidiary has largely been a residential mortgage story. Do you expect that to continue on -- how should we be thinking about the loan growth as maybe also a partial offset within the bank as we move through 2025?

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

We'll be looking to -- I think it's scheduled to launch later in the first-quarter fixed pledge and that's the -- we haven't had that yet and we know that's something that's sought-after in the wires. So we're adding that to the product portfolio. We'll also be coming out with HELOCs later in I think the second-quarter and along those lines. We're also going to be adding some other products on the deposit side, CDs in the bank as well as launching a checking account later in the year that would bring more balances into the bank and more utilization of the engagement with the bank that would also help on the loan side for some of the products we're coming out with. So we feel that there is an opportunity to increase the lending part of the portfolio as we go on. But remember, you know, we've been really focused on getting the bank really, really set-up and established and we're launching products periodically in them. But over-time, we feel like we can build a nice loan portfolio.

Brennan Hawken
Analyst at UBS Group

Okay. And the residential mortgage will probably still lead or is there an expected shift?

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Yes.

Brennan Hawken
Analyst at UBS Group

Okay. Thanks for taking my questions.

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Thanks.

Operator

And your next question comes from the line of Alex Blostein with Goldman Sachs. Alex, please go-ahead.

Luke Bianculli
Analyst at Goldman Sachs & Co.

Hi, all. This is Luke here on for Alex. Thanks for taking the question. Could you help us frame how you're thinking about the firm's capital strategy and particularly inorganic opportunities? I appreciate how consistent the repurchase cadence has been, but how are you thinking about inorganic opportunities specifically -- specifically within AWM where it feels like wealth peers are beginning to get more acquisitive? Thanks.

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Yes. So we feel like we have a consistent ability to redeploy capital through the buyback and dividend increases that we have based on the cash-flow generation we have across the business. And remember, in our RPS business, which is a very well-established business that has very good returns, that really gives us a lot more ability in that sense. From a perspective of acquisitions, we -- the market is a little bit pricey right now. I think private-equity has bid up things. If you're looking at the wealth segment. We focus more on bringing in appropriately appropriate types of advisers that have a good sort of perspective on how they want to do business on a client experience, on an advice-based solution, etc. And so we still see opportunity there. But from an acquisition perspective, we're more targeted in that regard. We also are investing to broaden out our channels. We have a number of opportunities, whether in A-Fig or in our own AAC and our central sites working more direct and we have some opportunities that we're looking at right now. So I feel-good about our ability to continue to grow both organically as well as looking at some of the newer channels that we're establishing are probably less so in the larger inorganic space right now based on what's happening in the marketplace?

Luke Bianculli
Analyst at Goldman Sachs & Co.

Yeah, loud and clear. Appreciate the color. Maybe just switching gears for a minute to asset Management. Do you see a path towards driving the business to closer to a neutral organic growth rate longer-term? And I know you touched on it at the top of the call, but what would you say are the biggest drivers to improvement to getting back there? Thanks again.

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Yes. So listen, I think the asset management business overall has been a bit more under pressure unless you have moved to passives or some of the alternative space and where that's growth as. So in our case, what we've been doing is really transforming the business, getting a lot more efficient. We took out a lot of cost and that will pay some dividends as we look at the flow rate that we've been experiencing. On the positive side, we see that our sales are increasing a bit on the growth side, both here and in Europe. We are branching out in different formats. So our model delivery, our SMAs, et-cetera, that we think will be a growing part of the franchise. That business and models and SMAs have grown to over $35 billion already. We think there's a bigger opportunity for us there. We are launching and have launched a number of active ETFs as the format has changed. People are starting to think of moving from passive now back into ETFs more in the format of active, which I think is good. As you know, pressure has come under the mutual fund part of the segment. But we have some excellent products in the mutual fund area, four and five-star funds that are really attracting some, especially in this changing environment. And we see an opportunity for us to gain a little bit more traction in Europe. But again, you know, that will take time. I think you can see that across the industry, but we feel like there is a path forward for us in the things I've mentioned. Institutional is a little more lumpy, but we are getting many more consultant approvals. We are branching out. We have gotten some nice flows in Japan right now as we set-up there. So I think that's going to be a little more lumpy, but I think over-time, we'll be able to build that out in a better way.

Luke Bianculli
Analyst at Goldman Sachs & Co.

Okay.

Operator

And your next question comes from the line of Steven Chubak with Wolfe Research. Steven, please go-ahead.

Michael Anagnostakis
Analyst at Wolfe Research

Hey, good morning. This is Michael on for Steven. Just wanted to touch on M&A here. Organic growth has been more resilient despite the industry seeing moderating flows in '24. Some of your peers have been more optimistic that could accelerate in '25 with a higher recruiting backlog with better market backdrop. So how do you see organic flows playing through based on that outlook and your recruiting backlog? And do you see a near-term path to getting back to the 5% plus level you had seen in '22 and '23? Thank you.

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

So I think overall, we've seen a nice pickup in the flow picture of both new net client flow coming in, but also more flow going back into the wrap programs. And we probably -- as we look at it, we think that the wrap business will continue that type of flow picture as we move forward. I can't sit here to sort of say what that looks like quarter-to-quarter just based on-market conditions and changes that occur. But I think people got a little more comfortable after the election, a little more that there'll be more solid GDP growth, the idea that things are a little more from a company earnings picture and other things and the employment picture. So I would probably say it's a positive environment there. From an idea of the pipeline for our recruits, as you saw, it was good in the 4th-quarter. Our pipeline looks good going into the new year. It's a very competitive marketplace. So you sort of can't predict. But again, recruiting is only a small part of what we do. We are bringing in a lot more people in adding to teams as well as newer people. And we also try to grow the productivity across our channel, which is very important for us. And so with our enhancements in technology and capabilities in our client experience, I think we're gaining some nice traction there that we think will be beneficial for us.

Michael Anagnostakis
Analyst at Wolfe Research

Very, very helpful color. So thank you for that, Jim. And just moving over maybe one on sweep cash. Solid growth in the quarter. There are some seasonal elements. I think you had mentioned in the prepared remarks, those tend to reverse during January to some degree. I mean, understanding we still have a day left in the month. Can you give us a mark-to-market on sweep cash January to date? Thank you so much.

Walter S. Berman
Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer at Ameriprise Financial

It's Walter. It's been fairly stable from that standpoint from the endpoint of December.

Michael Anagnostakis
Analyst at Wolfe Research

Got it. Thanks so much.

Operator

And your next question comes from the line of John Barnage with Piper Sandler. John, please go-ahead.

John Barnidge
Analyst at Piper Sandler & Co.

Good morning. Thanks for the opportunity. A question about long-term care and there was a benefit from premium rate increases in the quarter. With the decision to retain those long-term care assets a quarter ago with actuarial assumption review and those premium rate increases. Should we expect a higher-level of long-term care earnings to be borne out of corporate? And how do we view run-rate there? Thank you.

Walter S. Berman
Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Well, okay. So as we look at our benefit this year -- this quarter was from claims and from getting additional benefit rate increases. We certainly have been active in -- out there with pending benefit request, we have a process that has to go through to see if it gets approved and then how we reflect it. The thing I say, all the fundamentals are very good and they look good. It -- from that standpoint, I think we're on a good trajectory and we see it in a positive light. So I can't give you an exact number on this, but the trajectory of it is good. And like I said, we're coming into 2024, we -- $61 million we generated is certainly a very good positive element for that, and we anticipate we'll be continuing good growth and profitability.

John Barnidge
Analyst at Piper Sandler & Co.

Thank you. And my follow-up question for the Advice and wealth Management channel, can you talk about the alternative and private asset product portfolio and if that is becoming more demanded by advisors? Thank you.

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Yes. So we have added a good nice digital alternatives platform for our advisers. We've done a lot more due-diligence and adding products through the platform. I would probably say on the private credit side in our channel right now, it's small and but one that I think will start to grow. And I think there's an opportunity for us in the alternatives for our clients, particularly as our clients on the upper market start to look more for some of those product categories. So I would probably say we're at the early stages of that in our channel, but one that over-time would probably add as we add the capabilities and really have advisers start to think about where that fits in. But it's not going to be as you would say, in an ultra-high net-worth area, a large part of our activity, it will be part of a portfolio allocation because a lot of those assets are illiquid.

John Barnidge
Analyst at Piper Sandler & Co.

Thank you.

Operator

And your next question comes from the line of Wilma Burdes with Raymond James. Wilma, please go-ahead.

Wilma Burdis
Analyst at Raymond James

Hey, good morning. Corporate costs came in a bit lighter than we expected. Some of that was the outperformance in LTC, but could you help us think about the first-half of '25 given the ongoing cloud conversion and severance costs? Thanks.

Walter S. Berman
Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Corporate expense, okay, as you saw, if you -- we had those elements that we mentioned in the earnings release. And we do see it on -- if you were basically adjust for those that it's on the trajectory that you would think as we go-forward into 2025, that range of, 85%, 90%, 95 is in that range?

Wilma Burdis
Analyst at Raymond James

Okay, so maybe something more similar to 4Q. Is that fair for early in the year?

Walter S. Berman
Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Yeah, pretty much. Yes.

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Yes. So it will come -- we -- there'll be a bit less severance coming in. And as we go through the first and second-quarter, some of that technology or what -- yeah, change that we did on the transformation to the cloud for some of the mainframes, et-cetera, will start to dissipate.

Walter S. Berman
Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer at Ameriprise Financial

We'll work-through it in the personal quarter.

Wilma Burdis
Analyst at Raymond James

Hey, thank you. And could you give us a little bit more color on how you're thinking about G&A in '25 across the segments? Thanks

Walter S. Berman
Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer at Ameriprise Financial

As you know, we manage G&A quite well and certainly we as we looked at our programs this year and we started, you saw we've taken action on transformation to adjust the expense base as we look at processes and other changes. So we've accomplished a lot in 2024. Certainly, we're going to be continue -- some of that will continue to carryover into '25 and we're constantly looking to reengineer. As it relates to AWM, AWM, AWM, certainly, we're very prudent on managing our expenses, but we have expenses associated with activity and investment in growth. So it will be measured as it relates to looking at revenue generation, but we feel very good about our ability to certainly demonstrate -- continuing the demonstration of how we manage those expenses.

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Yeah. In the asset management business, some of the transformation that we did will move into '25 and give us some benefit as well. So overall, from a company perspective, we feel very good about how we're managing expenses. So all at this point, we are making good investments in the business in technology, AI capabilities. We also are having volume-related, particularly as you think about at AWM where we have good growth. And part of that variable expense for that is in the G&A. So it's not something, as you would say, is fixed overhead type things.

Wilma Burdis
Analyst at Raymond James

Okay, great. Thank you.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Ryan Krueger with KBW. Brian, please go-ahead.

Ryan Krueger
Analyst at Keefe, Bruyette & Woods

Hey, thanks. Good morning. My first question was a follow-up on the wrap flow trends. So you saw a pretty big increase in organic growth in the 4th-quarter to 8% from the more recent 6% trend. Can you comment on if that has continued at a similar pace so-far in January?

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Yeah. As we look at January is a little because of combination of the beginning of the month with some of the things that have occurred out there. So I would probably say things look consistent, but it's hard. January is a little as the start to the year. So it's not a perfect science for the rest of the quarter. But I don't think anything fundamental, I would probably say, but January is always a hard month-to take a flow from?

Ryan Krueger
Analyst at Keefe, Bruyette & Woods

Got it. And then on the AWM margin, the 29% in the 4th-quarter following the Fed rate cuts, do you feel that's a pretty reasonable expectation going-forward from here?

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Yes, I do.

Ryan Krueger
Analyst at Keefe, Bruyette & Woods

Okay, great. Thank you.

Operator

And our final question comes from the line of Kenneth Lee with RBC Capital Markets. Kenneth, please go-ahead.

Kenneth Lee
Analyst at RBC Capital Markets

Hey, thanks for taking my question. And apologies if this is covered before, but I'm juggling a couple of calls this morning. In terms of the bank assets, the portfolio there, you know that the bank fee yields were probably a little bit lower than I would have expected. Is there any kind of expectation around portfolio allocation across the assets in the business, perhaps a change in mix of fixed versus floating, you know, any additional color over the near-term? How you're thinking about that? Thanks.

Walter S. Berman
Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Sure. So listen, our mix has pretty much stayed the same. It's high-quality and duration is in the 3% to 5% range. We did, as I indicated, we came into the quarter with a 75% on fixed at the bank and we adjusted that to 87% of 87% fixed. So it -- and it's again the same quality and duration. So we feel that is -- we garnered from good rates. So that standpoint, that's the only change. Again, in the quarter, it was a 61 basis-point impact from the Fed and the impact for the bank was almost 30 some-odd basis-points based on that mix.

Kenneth Lee
Analyst at RBC Capital Markets

Got you. Very helpful there. And just one follow-up, if I may, just on the RPS side. Fair to say that over-time, higher/elevated yields could translate into higher earnings over-time. I just want to check-in on that and what are your expectations or outlook for the run-rate earnings for 2025 there? Thanks.

Walter S. Berman
Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Yeah. I think I covered that from the standpoint that certainly we feel comfortable with at the bank,

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

The RPS

Walter S. Berman
Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Excuse me,

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

RPS.

Walter S. Berman
Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Oh, RPS, I'm sorry. On RPS, based upon the fundamentals we're seeing both, again, we had a very good sales year, which obviously reduces the earnings and certainly from that standpoint, of course, the time of sale, but we do see the fundamentals there, good transactional growth and so and we're managing liability base is quite solid. So I feel from that standpoint, it's a pretty solid number

Kenneth Lee
Analyst at RBC Capital Markets

Got you. Very helpful there. Thanks again.

Operator

We have a new question from Michael Cyprus with Morgan Stanley. Michael, please go-ahead.

Michael Cyprys
Analyst at Morgan Stanley

Great. Thanks so much for squeezing me in here. Just a question as we think about expense efficiency efforts that you guys have executed quite well on in recent years. Just curious how much of that would you say is attributable to deploying AI versus maybe some of the generative AI tools. And as you look-forward from here, how do you see the potential of greater deployment of those capabilities to unleash incremental expense efficiencies? Maybe you could talk about some of the use cases you see on the horizon, including maybe even AI agents. What's that journey look like for Ameriprise? And then with the recent announcement, it seems like maybe there could be prospects for faster broader deployment. Just curious how you're thinking about that.

James M. Cracchiolo
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer at Ameriprise Financial

Yes. So we've been deploying intelligent automation robotics for a while and we continue to increase the number of areas that we deploy that in across the business. And so we see further opportunity for greater efficiency in that regard. We've also done a lot of work on AI and we've been running a lot of different cases that we're seeing some nice benefit from that we will be growing things out further. As an example, we've already gotten a level of efficiency, but we're working now to help advisers do business more easily, more productively, identifying opportunities in their book with clients. We're working with a lot of improving the client experience regarding our call-center interactions and how we reach-out to people. In Colombia, we've tested a lot in enhancing our research capabilities and utilizing that to drive efficiencies. So there's a number of things that we're looking at across. Now you also have to recognize that we're in a highly regulated space. So we have to really look at how you use that, what information is there, et-cetera, et-cetera, which we do. And we have a good governance process. But as we get more learnings and more test results from what we do, we can start to expand that and roll that out further. So I think that will be something that will be add. But if you're saying, are you getting great efficiencies yet from it? The answer is no. But we've gotten it for the things that we've really test and learned and deployed over-time like intelligent automation, but not yet on the generative AI, but that's been starting to be deployed now.

Michael Cyprys
Analyst at Morgan Stanley

Great. Thank you.

Operator

We have no further questions at this time. This concludes today's conference. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.

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